Substrate...thinking Of Replacing Gravel With Sand?

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Offline Flojo

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Substrate...thinking of replacing gravel with sand?
« on: September 29, 2019, 11:00:57 AM »
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Hi  :wave:

I have a 240l tank established for about 6 months with pea sized gravel.  Current inhabitants are:

8 Black Skirt Tetra
8 Harlequin Rasboras
1 BN Plec
1 Siamese Algae Eater
2 yoyo loaches
3 Bleeding Heart Tetras
2 UpsideDown Catfish

I love my yoyo loaches and am thinking of getting either 2-3 Kuhli Loaches or a weather loach, but see they should have sand substrate.  Is it worth making the change from gravel to sand?  If so, how do I do this with minimal disruption to my fish?

 :fishy1:


A Selection of Fish in my Fish Community Creator Tanks
Black Widow Tetra (8) - Bristlenose Plec (2) - Yoyo Loach (2) - Siamese Flying Fox (1) - Bleeding Heart Tetra (5) - Upside-Down Catfish (2) - Platy (5) - Tiger Barb (4) - Silver Tip Tetra (2) - Japonica Shrimp (3) - Dwarf Gourami (1) - Angelfish (5) - Neon Tetra (4) - Zebra Danio (2) - Silver Tip Tetra (2) - Japonica Shrimp (4) - Cardinal Tetra (1) - Fiveband Barb (2) - Dwarf Gourami (1) - Ember Tetra (2) - Glowlight Tetra (1) - Harlequin Rasbora (2) - Three Spot Gourami (1) -
Note: The user may not necessarily own these fish, these are tanks that they may be building or researching for stocking purposes


Offline Sue

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Re: Substrate...thinking of replacing gravel with sand?
« Reply #1 on: September 29, 2019, 12:43:53 PM »
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Hi, welcome to the forum  :wave:

It is definitely worth changing the gravel. All bottom dwellers prefer it.

It will make a mess. If you have a large container where you can house the fish for a few hours, it is worth removing them for the duration. (I have a fish-only dustbin I use for things like this  :) )If you don't, you'll have to do it with the fish in there so be a slow and careful as you can so you don't stress the fish too much.

Firstly, don't feed the fish the day before. And thoroughly wash the sand before you start as some types have a lot of dust and will need to be washed well.
On changeover day, remove some water into the container and place the fish in there. If you can use a large net placed in the front corner and use your hand to herd the fish into the net it will cause least stress. If there are any live plants, put them in the container as well. Cover the container as stressed fish will jump.
Turn off the heater and filter and scoop out the gravel. There will be a lot of muck in the gravel so you may need to remove a lot of water afterwards. Then place the sand in the tank and refill, planting any plants when there is a few inches of water. Pouring water straight in will make a crater. There are ways to prevent this, such as putting a plate or saucer on the sand and pouring the water onto that; loosely wrapping a plastic bag round the hose if you use one to refill; if you use a bucket to refill, pour the water through a colander so there are many water streams rather than one large one (I use a 170 ml yogurt pot with a lot of holes stabbed in it with a knitting needle). Before the tank is completely full, put the fish and the water they are in back in the tank and then fill right up.
Don't feed the fish that day or the day after, then feed half portions for a few days. Monitor the ammonia and nitrite levels daily for a week, and do a water change if either show above zero. The gravel in there now contains a lot of good bacteria which you will lose when you remove it. Reducing the amount of food reduces the amount of ammonia the fish make. I changed from gravel to sand a few years ago and never saw any ammonia or nitrite by doing this.

The cheapest sand is play sand. It is free from any contamination - it has to be because children will eat some of the sand. But is does tend to be quite dusty. If you would rather go with a sand made for aquariums, check is does not alter hardness or pH - there are some sands made from crushed coral, limestone etc which are intended for use with hard water fish which will alter the water chemistry.






I need to make a comment about the fish you have an intend; it is not a  criticism, rather what is best for the fish. Rather than getting kuhli or weather loaches you do need to get at least 4 more yoyo loaches. These are shoaling fish which need to be in a  group of at least 6. So do the bleeding heart tetras.


Offline Flojo

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Re: Substrate...thinking of replacing gravel with sand?
« Reply #2 on: September 29, 2019, 12:57:43 PM »
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Hi Sue

Thanks for the advice...i did have 5 bleeding heart tetras but lost a couple mysteriously a month or so ago, never did find any evidence of them  :-\, but I agree, i am planning on getting another 3 but my LFS are out of stock and are awaiting them. 

I've heard conflicting advice on the yoyo's....my two seem very content, so hadn't worried too much about it, but i may increase their numbers too.

I may go along the lines of increasing the yoyo's and get glass catfish (6) instead to save changing the gravel, it seems a lot of work  :yikes:


A Selection of Fish in my Fish Community Creator Tanks
Black Widow Tetra (8) - Bristlenose Plec (2) - Yoyo Loach (2) - Siamese Flying Fox (1) - Bleeding Heart Tetra (5) - Upside-Down Catfish (2) - Platy (5) - Tiger Barb (4) - Silver Tip Tetra (2) - Japonica Shrimp (3) - Dwarf Gourami (1) - Angelfish (5) - Neon Tetra (4) - Zebra Danio (2) - Silver Tip Tetra (2) - Japonica Shrimp (4) - Cardinal Tetra (1) - Fiveband Barb (2) - Dwarf Gourami (1) - Ember Tetra (2) - Glowlight Tetra (1) - Harlequin Rasbora (2) - Three Spot Gourami (1) -
Note: The user may not necessarily own these fish, these are tanks that they may be building or researching for stocking purposes


Offline Sue

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Re: Substrate...thinking of replacing gravel with sand?
« Reply #3 on: September 29, 2019, 02:26:11 PM »
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Nowadays I always get more than I actually want with shoaling fish as I have found over the years that some of them die quite quickly after purchase.

Glass catfish do have particular needs - they need dim lighting so floating plants are a must in a tank with these fish. Again, they need 6 or more.

Offline Matt

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Re: Substrate...thinking of replacing gravel with sand?
« Reply #4 on: September 29, 2019, 09:38:36 PM »
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If you do decide to change to sand, go with a product which states that it has been "kiln dried". The kiln dried sand from B&Q is excellent and does not require washing which is a godsend and is also very natural in colour.  I have done it with fish in the tank before now. It was a bit messy but I personally felt is far less stressful for my species than catching them as they are notoriously difficult to catch. I would only do it with a product I knew such as the above which does not impact water quality or contain lots if dusts.

The way I went about it was to remove the hardscape, use a siphon hose to take out the gravel, then simply dump in the sand using a small jug.  There are better ways of doing this though (I was rushing)...

Use a funnel to pour the sand into a drinks bottle. Fill with water. Put on lid. Turn so lid at bottom. Place in tank. Undo lid.

The act of the heavier sand falling out of the bottle will draw water back in so any clouding stays in the bottle. You will also get a nice gentle drift of sand from the bottle which you can direct to your liking around the tank.

Offline Hampalong

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Re: Substrate...thinking of replacing gravel with sand?
« Reply #5 on: September 29, 2019, 09:52:42 PM »
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My tuppence worth...

Not all bottom dwellers prefer sand. A lot of rivers have gravel bottoms. They also have bottom dwellers. It all depends on the species and it’s natural environment.

Kuhlies definitely do prefer sand. They should also be in a group (6+).

The Upside down Cats, SAE, and yo-yos should also be in a group (and the bleeding hearts, as already said).

Glass cats absolutely need a group (as do UD cats, which live in schools of hundreds) and won’t do well otherwise. They also need dim lighting and minimal water movement. Very much a ‘special needs’ fish, which are usually not kept properly.

For Kuhlies, UD Cats, and Glass Cats, the more the better. Personally I would have a dozen or more of one of those species only.

:)

Offline Flojo

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Re: Substrate...thinking of replacing gravel with sand?
« Reply #6 on: October 01, 2019, 07:47:56 PM »
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Thanks for all your advice guys, I will definitely increase my numbers of yoyo's, bleeding hearts and UDcatfish...and maybe attempt to change to sand when I'm feeling braver about it all.

 

A Selection of Fish in my Fish Community Creator Tanks
Black Widow Tetra (8) - Bristlenose Plec (2) - Yoyo Loach (2) - Siamese Flying Fox (1) - Bleeding Heart Tetra (5) - Upside-Down Catfish (2) - Platy (5) - Tiger Barb (4) - Silver Tip Tetra (2) - Japonica Shrimp (3) - Dwarf Gourami (1) - Angelfish (5) - Neon Tetra (4) - Zebra Danio (2) - Silver Tip Tetra (2) - Japonica Shrimp (4) - Cardinal Tetra (1) - Fiveband Barb (2) - Dwarf Gourami (1) - Ember Tetra (2) - Glowlight Tetra (1) - Harlequin Rasbora (2) - Three Spot Gourami (1) -
Note: The user may not necessarily own these fish, these are tanks that they may be building or researching for stocking purposes


Offline Hampalong

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Re: Substrate...thinking of replacing gravel with sand?
« Reply #7 on: October 01, 2019, 08:00:23 PM »
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Are you sure they’re genuine UDs? Sometimes other Synos get sold as UDs, especially eupterus... in which case you should only have one.

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