Hello Fish Lovers

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Offline Susanne

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Hello fish lovers
« on: March 17, 2014, 09:18:41 PM »
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I was given an aquarium, empty of fish and plants, because the owners got tired of it. It measures 48 x 48x 48cm. (110 litres). I put in several new plants, (7 in total) went through the usual set up with treated water etc. I have a great aquatic centre nearby and they have given me great advice on how to add the tropical fish gradually. Water seems ok when testing.

However, my plants are now covered in Brown algae. I talked to the fish shop and they advised that my lighting was wrong and I have now shelled out £149 on daylight lighting. It's not made any difference in a week, everything is covered in horrible Brown algae.

I have 6 zebra Danios and 3 Bronze Corys so far, intend to get some algae eaters next, but I'm really frustrated at the expense and apparent lack of improvement. The fish appear happy and I love watching them. I want a good aquarium fit for the fish that looks good. I have added clay plant balls and feed with liquid plant food weekly. The tank is now about 5 weeks old since I started it.

Offline dbaggie

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Re: Hello fish lovers
« Reply #1 on: March 17, 2014, 09:35:41 PM »
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Hi Susanne

I've only got back into fishkeeping relatively recently so I'm no expert but another forum member (SteveS) provided me with a link to a site with detailed information about aquarium nutrients for plants and I noticed that there's also a good section about algae - try this link: http://www.theplantedtank.co.uk/algae.htm.

According to the site it sounds like you may have diatoms which is apparently quite common in new tanks and should disappear as your tank matures. I'm not really sure about the light situation - do you know what lighting you had and what you've upgraded to?

I'm sure there'll be a few on here who know exactly what the problem is - it may also help if you supply some of your testing results for your tank water.

Hope it clears up soon!

Offline ColinB

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Re: Hello fish lovers
« Reply #2 on: March 18, 2014, 07:59:15 AM »
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Hello and Welcome to the forum, Susanne.

After five weeks your tank may not be fully cycled yet and the diatoms could have grown with the excess ammonia. What are your test kit results for ammonia, nitrites and nitrates?

I would be inclined not to worry too much about the diatoms at the moment. It can take six months or so for your aquarium to mature with it's full compliment of all the different sort of bugglies that exist. It's tempting to only think about the ammonia and nitrate eaters, but there are many others. If you start 'messing' with the chemistry too quickly you're in danger of not spotting what's happening as each change can take many weeks to become apparant - you won't spot any changes in a week.

Patience you must.  ;D

A Selection of Fish in my Fish Community Creator Tanks
Panda Cory (7) - Honey Gourami (3) - Ember Tetra (9) - Lemon Tetra (4) - Cherry Barb (1) - Otocinclus (2) -
Note: The user may not necessarily own these fish, these are tanks that they may be building or researching for stocking purposes


Offline Sue

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Re: Hello fish lovers
« Reply #3 on: March 18, 2014, 08:09:18 AM »
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Hi Susanne,

Brown algae is common in new tanks. As Colin says, it's main cause is ammonia in the water.

You say the water tests seems OK - have you got your own liquid reagent test kits (strips are inaccurate) or is the shop doing them? And if it the shop, are they telling you the numbers or just something like 'fine' or 'OK'?
For ammonia and nitrite, anything other than zero is not OK. Since it sounds as though you are doing a fish-in cycle, your readings for ammonia and then nitrite are likely to be going up.
Five weeks in, your ammonia level should be dropping by now, though it is unlikely to be zero yet, and your nitrite could be high.
Can I suggest you read this to see what I am talking about. You will be about half way through the process after 5 weeks.


Just a warning about shops - most of them just want to sell you something. Don't believe anything they say until you double check it. The fact that they sold you expensive lighting to cure a problem is a good indicator that your shop is more interested in your money than your tank. What you needed to do was lots of water changes rather than buy equipment.

Offline Richard W

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Re: Hello fish lovers
« Reply #4 on: March 18, 2014, 08:15:18 AM »
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And stop adding the liquid fertiliser. Algae are plants too, and they will benefit from the fertiliser more than your other plants. If you just have plain gravel in your tank, then you may need to put fertiliser tablets in at the roots of your plants, where the nutrients are available to the plants but not to the algae..

Offline Milton

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Re: Hello fish lovers
« Reply #5 on: March 18, 2014, 01:43:18 PM »
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It also wont just go away, ive found you have to physically remove it.  Then if your chemistry is correct it wont come back.

Offline Susanne

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Re: Hello fish lovers
« Reply #6 on: March 18, 2014, 02:29:39 PM »
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Many thanks for all your helpful replies. I will read them all carefully tonight when I'm not at work. I will try to be patient!

I test the water with strips, which I was told was the easiest option - but obviously not the best one, I see now.

I have put some clay plant food balls in the gravel. The light I bought is a "daylight" light, square with about 6 lights in it. I originally had a blue and a white standard tube light.

Do you think the existing plants will recover or shall I leave them and start again in a few weeks' time? I just want to get this right and have happy fish and a beautiful tank - and stop spending money!  :( The fish seem very happy though.

Susanne

Offline Milton

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Re: Hello fish lovers
« Reply #7 on: March 18, 2014, 02:42:37 PM »
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Not the cheapest by any means, but ive had better results with T5 lighting.  This is a little tank i set up for nano fishes, pencilfish, dwarf corys, etc.  its only been up for about 2 months. Plant growth is great, and no brown algae at all.


Offline Susanne

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Re: Hello fish lovers
« Reply #8 on: March 18, 2014, 03:09:22 PM »
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Looks lovely!  :)

Offline SteveS

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Re: Hello fish lovers
« Reply #9 on: March 18, 2014, 03:11:16 PM »
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Do you think the existing plants will recover or shall I leave them and start again in a few weeks' time?
They are resilient and will recover. You may have to remove some of the more affected leaves or shoots, but as time goes on the new shoots will be clear and free of algae and your tank will improve. Just remember, it's a complex interdependent environment you are trying to establish. In its early days it will be a bit fragile, so resist the urge to go wading in with all guns blazing. "Slow and steady wins the race" as someone once said.

A Selection of Fish in my Fish Community Creator Tanks
Angelfish (1) - Panda Cory (10) - Harlequin Rasbora (10) - Otocinclus (10) - Japonica Shrimp (10) - Honey Gourami (10) - Galaxy Rasbora (10) -
Note: The user may not necessarily own these fish, these are tanks that they may be building or researching for stocking purposes


Offline ColinB

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Re: Hello fish lovers
« Reply #10 on: March 18, 2014, 03:26:33 PM »
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Not the cheapest by any means, but ive had better results with T5 lighting.  This is a little tank i set up for nano fishes, pencilfish, dwarf corys, etc.  its only been up for about 2 months. Plant growth is great, and no brown algae at all.



Ah - that's how you get your tea-coloured water. You seem to have dropped your mug in! :rotfl:

A Selection of Fish in my Fish Community Creator Tanks
Panda Cory (7) - Honey Gourami (3) - Ember Tetra (9) - Lemon Tetra (4) - Cherry Barb (1) - Otocinclus (2) -
Note: The user may not necessarily own these fish, these are tanks that they may be building or researching for stocking purposes


Offline Milton

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Re: Hello fish lovers
« Reply #11 on: March 18, 2014, 04:19:38 PM »
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 :rotfl:  actually thats a copper pot i found at a yard sale, serves 2 purposes.  a good fish hideout, and a tiny bit of copper leaches into the water to help control algae, and since i dont have inverts in this tank, the copper is not an issue.

Offline ColinB

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Re: Hello fish lovers
« Reply #12 on: March 18, 2014, 04:42:49 PM »
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Ah..... even more curious that you say this, given my other post a moment ago in the 'barb' thread.

Spooky.........

A Selection of Fish in my Fish Community Creator Tanks
Panda Cory (7) - Honey Gourami (3) - Ember Tetra (9) - Lemon Tetra (4) - Cherry Barb (1) - Otocinclus (2) -
Note: The user may not necessarily own these fish, these are tanks that they may be building or researching for stocking purposes


Offline Milton

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Re: Hello fish lovers
« Reply #13 on: March 18, 2014, 05:09:06 PM »
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Spooky ??

Well, since it seems Colin doesnt appreciate my presence here, i will go back to my own forum where i belong.  :-\

Offline ColinB

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Re: Hello fish lovers
« Reply #14 on: March 18, 2014, 06:12:43 PM »
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Spooky ??

Well, since it seems Colin doesnt appreciate my presence here, i will go back to my own forum where i belong.  :-\

No, no, no, no, no, no, absolutely no intent of anything other than general silliness based around the likeness of the cartoon you posted to that of Getafix the Druid from Asterix and his copper cauldren. Perhaps you don't know the Asterix books?

No offense of any sort intended. :-[

A Selection of Fish in my Fish Community Creator Tanks
Panda Cory (7) - Honey Gourami (3) - Ember Tetra (9) - Lemon Tetra (4) - Cherry Barb (1) - Otocinclus (2) -
Note: The user may not necessarily own these fish, these are tanks that they may be building or researching for stocking purposes


Offline Susanne

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Re: Hello fish lovers
« Reply #15 on: March 18, 2014, 09:25:54 PM »
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To get back on subject, I took a water sample to my fish shop tonight. The water quality, Inc ammonia, is fine. My tank is placed in a room with lots of Sun, that's the way our living room is with lots of glass, so... different ways to go. I've started adding algae stopping liquid, will close the blinds during daylight and have removed the existing plants. Currently soaking wood and plan to get plants that will grow on there so I can remove and clean. This is the first step to see how it goes, if no success, May consider ultraviolet light through the filter.

I wasn't aware of the danger of Sun/natural light, so hope to be able to manage as no other place for tank to sit and lots of glass in our living room.

At least my fish appear ok. Disturbed substrate tonight to see level of cleanliness. Will do a Hoover when I do a water change this w/e.

I intend to get a good set up come what may!  :)

Offline Sue

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Re: Hello fish lovers
« Reply #16 on: March 19, 2014, 08:26:36 AM »
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Algae doesn't seem to harm fish directly, it's the things that cause algae that can harm them. Glad to hear your water tests are OK.

Offline SteveS

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Re: Hello fish lovers
« Reply #17 on: March 19, 2014, 01:32:52 PM »
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So, wading in with all guns blazing it is.

Algae are plants, they are just more primitive than the type of plants that we actually want to take up residence. There is no chance, or desire really, to have an algae-free tank. Algae perform useful functions. What we want is an environment where the algae is under control. Algae gets out of control because it is more able to rapidly adjust to changes to its environment; These changes are especially prevalent when our tank is immature, as yours is. When the plants adjust to these changes they will out-compete the algae for access to the nutrients available and thus naturally limit the growth of algae.

The way we approach this with a new tank is to select easy to grow vigorous plants such as Hygrophilia polyspermia or Elodea densa or Cabomba caroliniana or Ceratophyllum demersum or others. These are plants that don't require large expensive light fittings, specialist substrates or great skills to flourish. They will however, grow quickly and keep algae growth to a minimum whilst the rest of the habitat is maturing. Later, if you desire, you can whip them out and replace them with something more challenging as your skills evolve.

My tank is placed in a room with lots of Sun, that's the way our living room is with lots of glass, so...
This is probably the biggest problem you have. There are only two solutions. Move the tank or shield it with blinds or some similar arrangement. Failing either of these it is more important than ever that you produce a thriving and vigorous plant mass within your tank. Probably the last thing you require are fancy-dan "daylight lights". It is also important that you pay especial care to limit the lighting period of your lighting to give the plants a "dark" period. Limiting the amount of light available in this manner also helps to limit the amount of light delivered to the algae.

I've started adding algae stopping liquid
Algaecides are not the solution. They can introduce more problems than they solve. All the dead algae ends up polluting the water column with ammonia as they decompose. Not what we wish for when performing a fish-in cycle as you are.

...and have removed the existing plants.
Strong plant growth is the primary algae suppressant in an aquarium so you should really replace them.

Currently soaking wood and plan to get plants that will grow on there so I can remove and clean.
You are unlikely to achieve the sorts of growth levels required by using plants that attach to wood. These tend to be fairly small slow growing species.

May consider ultraviolet light through the filter.
UV may be an effective treatment for algae. However it can work as a suppressant to a fishes natural immune system if used for prolonged periods.

Disturbed substrate tonight to see level of cleanliness.
Unless you are vacuuming your substrate you should limit the amount of disturbance to it. The reason is that you tend to lift all the nutrients that are held in your gravel into the water column where the algae can utilise them. This can often cause algae blooms. These nutrients come from two main sources; uneaten fish-food and fish poo.


Finally ("at last" I hear you say) I feel that it is important that you start to think more critically about the advice you are receiving from your shop. You seemed to be pleased with the advice you have received from them according to your initial post. From my point of view, you have been grievously misled.

Regards Steve.

A Selection of Fish in my Fish Community Creator Tanks
Angelfish (1) - Panda Cory (10) - Harlequin Rasbora (10) - Otocinclus (10) - Japonica Shrimp (10) - Honey Gourami (10) - Galaxy Rasbora (10) -
Note: The user may not necessarily own these fish, these are tanks that they may be building or researching for stocking purposes


Offline SteveS

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Re: Hello fish lovers
« Reply #18 on: March 19, 2014, 01:34:50 PM »
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Spooky ??

Well, since it seems Colin doesnt appreciate my presence here, i will go back to my own forum where i belong.  :-\
Colin! Stop frightening the newcomers!

That's my job!  :rotfl:

A Selection of Fish in my Fish Community Creator Tanks
Angelfish (1) - Panda Cory (10) - Harlequin Rasbora (10) - Otocinclus (10) - Japonica Shrimp (10) - Honey Gourami (10) - Galaxy Rasbora (10) -
Note: The user may not necessarily own these fish, these are tanks that they may be building or researching for stocking purposes


Offline ColinB

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Re: Hello fish lovers
« Reply #19 on: March 19, 2014, 01:47:10 PM »
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Spooky ??

Well, since it seems Colin doesnt appreciate my presence here, i will go back to my own forum where i belong.  :-\
Colin! Stop frightening the newcomers!

That's my job!  :rotfl:

Sorry, Steve. I was just practising for when you go on holiday!  :-[

A Selection of Fish in my Fish Community Creator Tanks
Panda Cory (7) - Honey Gourami (3) - Ember Tetra (9) - Lemon Tetra (4) - Cherry Barb (1) - Otocinclus (2) -
Note: The user may not necessarily own these fish, these are tanks that they may be building or researching for stocking purposes


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