Very Unwell And Wobbly Tiger Barbs

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Offline Littlefish

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Very unwell and wobbly tiger barbs
« on: October 14, 2016, 07:23:46 PM »
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The poorly tiger barb problem still hasn't been resolved.
I have been doing daily water changes, and water parameters are still fine (0, 0, 40).
This evening everyone has had peas (including the tiger barbs) for dinner.
I've just gone for a look at the tiger barb tank and one of the dominant males is doing the wobbly swimming thing that the others were doing. This leads me to expect that the fella will pass away within the next day.
What is wrong with them? When he is swimming he is also floating, spinning, turning, and doesn't really seem to have much control over what he's doing. What should I do?

Offline fcmf

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Re: Very unwell and wobbly tiger barbs
« Reply #1 on: October 14, 2016, 08:33:30 PM »
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Can I just check one thing with you - is the behaviour you're describing at a fairly normal pace ie the fish isn't going at a ridiculously crazed pace? [The reason I'm asking is because I've been reading lately and have seen videos of very alarming situations of fish in the latter situation, and reading experts' thoughts/responses on this - no-one can quite agree on the course of action to take.]

If the pace is fairly normal, then it sounds like some sort of swimbladder malfunction but these are often bacterial in origin, and the eSHa 2000 would be the best course of action for treatment given that you've also mentioned finrot and fungus. Some of this sounds similar to what was happening to my pygmy cories and, while I don't know the root cause, I have a couple of theories (in my signature) but it may well have been entirely outwith my control - as your situation seems too, unfortunately, as I'm stumped as to what further advice to offer over-and-above what I've suggested already.

The only other option that might work is a dose of aquarium salt but you need to be very careful with this in tropicals - whether to use it or not, and getting the dosage correct. It may be worth googling to see whether tiger barbs would tolerate it. [I used it to good effect with my goldfish.]

Offline Littlefish

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Re: Very unwell and wobbly tiger barbs
« Reply #2 on: October 14, 2016, 08:58:34 PM »
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It's a normal pace of swimming, but with what appears to be uncontrolled floating/turning/etc.
The fish that I noticed earlier was moved to the quarantine tank, but unfortunately I think I must have stressed him out by doing this and he has already passed away.
I have dosed the main tiger barb tank with esha2000, in the hope of doing something useful.
Whatever the problem is, it seems to happen very quickly.
I'm worried that I'm going to end up watching them die one by one, very quickly and on a daily basis.

Offline fcmf

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Re: Very unwell and wobbly tiger barbs
« Reply #3 on: October 14, 2016, 09:22:53 PM »
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How horrible for you to be in this situation.

This is beyond my realm of experience/expertise, and I don't know what else to advise other than sincere sympathy / concern.

The aforementioned discussion I was referring to was talking about "sleeping sickness" in fish - a fishkeeper found that her black neons, harlequins, etc, were swimming at a ridiculously crazy rate and suffering from swimbladder type problems and dying suddenly, one by one, for no particular reason given her water quality, etc. Amongst numerous pieces of different advice, and contradictory advice, the presence of parasites producing these symptoms and Waterlife Octozin has been suggested as a remedy for her to try - however, I wouldn't proceed down this route in your case until @Sue or someone else more experienced than me can comment on the potential merits or otherwise of this treatment, and I certainly don't want to be misleading you up the wrong track.

Offline Littlefish

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Re: Very unwell and wobbly tiger barbs
« Reply #4 on: October 15, 2016, 07:32:18 AM »
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@fcmf your sympathy and support is appreciated.
I don't know what to do at the moment. I haven't switched on any tank lights yet and it's still not really light enough to see anything in the tiger barb tank at the moment.
All of the barbs that have died so far are the standard tiger barbs, none of the green ones, but I shuld imagine that is more of a coincidence than anything else.
Unless I get any other suggestions I will continue to monitor the situation, perform daily water changes, and do reduced feeds/pea feeds for now.

Offline Sue

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Re: Very unwell and wobbly tiger barbs
« Reply #5 on: October 15, 2016, 09:26:35 AM »
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The colour of the affected barbs may not be co-incidence. Did you buy all the affected standard barbs at the same time from the same shop, and the green separately? If this is what you did, there is a slim possibility it is genetic with all the fish bought at the same time being siblings. I do realise this is not likely but it is within the bounds of possibility.

Waterlife Octozin treats "sleeping sickness, hole in the head...." so this is why fcmf's reference used it. I had never heard of sleeping sickness so I've had to google it.
To be honest, I have no idea what the cause is, and knowing the cause is the key to treatments. But of all the treatments on the market I would use eSHa 2000 for external and internal bacterial infections. For internal parasites, the appropriate medication should be used. However, nothing will help against viruses.


All I can suggest otherwise is to keep on as you are and to use separate equipment for this tank just in case it is something infectious.

Offline Littlefish

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Re: Very unwell and wobbly tiger barbs
« Reply #6 on: October 15, 2016, 02:06:20 PM »
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I've just pulled another dead tiger barb from the tank.
I didn't see it when I did the water change this morning, even when moving decor to do a quick gravel hoover. No idea where it was.
I have purchased the barbs from 2 stores several months apart. I think that all the ones that have died may have been the standard ones from the first batch, but I can't be 100% certain as the 2nd few standard tiger barbs weren't much smaller.

Offline Littlefish

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Re: Very unwell and wobbly tiger barbs
« Reply #7 on: October 16, 2016, 07:35:12 PM »
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I did a 40% water change on the tiger barb tank this morning.
I also went to the LFS and had a chat with them about what was happening, to see if they had anything to add.
Anyway, so far none of the tiger barbs have died today.
Unfortunately that only leaves me with 4 standard and 9 green tiger barbs, but at least the numbers haven't diminished any further. I plan to continue with the daily water changes, and if the numbers of fish remain the same for a few days I'll start doing smaller/less frequent changes until back to the normal weekly routine.
Fingers crossed.

Offline Matt

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Re: Very unwell and wobbly tiger barbs
« Reply #8 on: October 16, 2016, 08:01:12 PM »
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Good luck!  Keep us updated.

Offline fcmf

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Re: Very unwell and wobbly tiger barbs
« Reply #9 on: October 16, 2016, 10:23:26 PM »
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Glad to read that there have been no more fatalities today (touchwood).

Your proposed course of action sounds good. All the best and hopefully this unfortunate bad spell has / will have run its course.





Offline Littlefish

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Re: Very unwell and wobbly tiger barbs
« Reply #10 on: October 17, 2016, 07:54:12 AM »
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No fatalities overnight, although none of them were overly impressed with being woken up to be counted this morning.
I don't want to speak too soon, but I hope that this is the beginning of the end of the problem.

Offline Littlefish

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Re: Very unwell and wobbly tiger barbs
« Reply #11 on: October 17, 2016, 05:34:16 PM »
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No fatalities during the day either. I got home to 4 standard and 9 green tiger barbs, the same as yesterday.  :)

Offline fcmf

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Re: Very unwell and wobbly tiger barbs
« Reply #12 on: October 17, 2016, 07:41:44 PM »
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Relieved to read that. Am sure you are approaching the tank with trepidation, wondering what you might find. Let's hope you can soon relax.
 :cheers:

Offline Littlefish

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Re: Very unwell and wobbly tiger barbs
« Reply #13 on: October 18, 2016, 06:07:22 PM »
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All tiger barbs seem full of energy today.
I've just done a 20% water change, the barbs chased the syphon around the tank (adorable, if a tad unhelpful) then started nibbling on my hand as I was cleaning the gravel. Cheeky monkeys.
I still have no idea what was wrong with them last week, but at least the problem seems to have resolved itself for now. Hooray.  ;D

Offline Sue

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Re: Very unwell and wobbly tiger barbs
« Reply #14 on: October 18, 2016, 06:36:23 PM »
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That's annoying behaviour but a good sign. A fish that isn't very well usually hides in a corner during a water change.

Fingers crossed that they are over whatever-it-was.

Offline fcmf

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Re: Very unwell and wobbly tiger barbs
« Reply #15 on: October 18, 2016, 07:24:16 PM »
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All tiger barbs seem full of energy today.
I've just done a 20% water change, the barbs chased the syphon around the tank (adorable, if a tad unhelpful) then started nibbling on my hand as I was cleaning the gravel. Cheeky monkeys.
I still have no idea what was wrong with them last week, but at least the problem seems to have resolved itself for now. Hooray.  ;D
Great news. That does indeed sound adorable. I think that's their way of appreciating the concern you had for them and their acknowledgement that you're doing your best for them. People vastly under-estimate fish but, from what I've seen during my experience, I wouldn't be in the least surprised if this was as I describe.

Offline ColinB

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Re: Very unwell and wobbly tiger barbs
« Reply #16 on: October 19, 2016, 07:34:07 AM »
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Sounds like you're on top of whatever the problem was. Here's hoping it stays that way.

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Offline Littlefish

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Re: Very unwell and wobbly tiger barbs
« Reply #17 on: October 19, 2016, 04:42:44 PM »
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Again I have some very active tiger barbs at feeding time.
I am going to now assume that they are over whatever happened last week, and that everything is starting to settle down.

@fcmf - it would be nice to think that the fish were showing their appreciation. However, I think it is much more likely that they were trying to chase the syphon out of the tank after seeing it on such a regular basis over the previous week. I think it's also quite likely that they were nibbling my hand either to see if I was edible, or to assert their dominance in their own tank, or to chase my hand out of their territory. Possibly the first one, considering what they are like at feeding time.  ;D

Nice to see them looking better though, so I'm happy.  :)

Offline Paddyc

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Re: Very unwell and wobbly tiger barbs
« Reply #18 on: October 20, 2016, 01:54:29 PM »
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Glad to hear you seem to have sorted this problem Donna, a great example to new users that sometimes a patient and low-impact approach is better than drastic action with major water changes and a bombardment of chemicals...

Hope the barbs stay happy and healthy. Indeed, all of your fish  ;)

Offline Littlefish

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Re: Very unwell and wobbly tiger barbs
« Reply #19 on: October 20, 2016, 05:26:52 PM »
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Thanks Paddy.
 :)

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