'Ulcer' On Betta's Head.

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Offline tattooedcat

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'Ulcer' on Betta's head.
« on: February 01, 2015, 09:15:57 AM »
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Hi, could anyone help me with what I can only describe as an ulcer on my little mate's head? I've attached photos and my fingers are crossed that they upload.

I've had Jezza for around 4 months now, no problems with him at all until a few days ago when he developed a really raw looking patch on the top of his head. My first thoughts were that he'd caught himself on something in the tank. It doesn't look quite so raw looking now but does seem bigger. In all other respects he seems very healthy, his colour is good, he's eating well, he's still very lively and inquisitive. He's had a ragged tail for a while now but no signs of rotting back at all. There are no other lesions on his body.

The nuts and bolts of his care are as follows: He lives in a filtered 38l/47cm Aqua Ecostyle tank. Ammonia is at 0, nitrites are also at 0. I haven't tested for nitrates but hope that as I am really religious about doing water changes and substrate cleaning twice a week, they shouldn't be a problem. He's fed a mixture of flake and frozen bloodworm/daphnia (he won't touch betta pellets!).  Previously there were platys in the tank which where removed when I got him. They left behind fry and 2 females have survived. The platys are showing no signs of disease and although they all seem to get on very well, it was my intention to rehome the platys. I've been treating his tank with Melafix for 3 days now but unfortunately I can't remove the carbon from the filter.

I'd be really grateful for any ideas of what this thing is on his head and also if there's anything else I can do. I have become very fond of the little fella and really don't want to lose him.  :(

My thanks.


Offline Richard W

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Re: 'Ulcer' on Betta's head.
« Reply #1 on: February 01, 2015, 09:45:45 AM »
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Could it possibly be a heater burn? Bettas are well known for this, resting part of the body on the heater.

Offline tattooedcat

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Re: 'Ulcer' on Betta's head.
« Reply #2 on: February 01, 2015, 09:58:19 AM »
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Yes, there is a chance that he could burn himself although that hadn't occurred to me before now (thank you!). There is room for him to swim around it and he does tend to hang around there, sometimes squeezed between the heater and the side of the tank.

This kind of begs the question of how to shield him from the heater and also what I need to be doing to treat what might be a possible burn.

Offline Richard W

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Re: 'Ulcer' on Betta's head.
« Reply #3 on: February 01, 2015, 10:21:39 AM »
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You can get plastic guards for heaters, there are plenty on EBay, for example

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Length-8-5-Aquarium-Fish-Tank-Heater-Guard-Protector-Cover-Suction-Cups-Dia-1-/321381467186?pt=UK_Pet_Supplies_Fish&hash=item4ad3d40432

These sort of injuries generally clear up on their own, just maintain excellent standards of hygiene to reduce the chances of infection. If signs of infection do develop, then treat with any basic med for bacteria, though it probably won't be necessary.

Offline tattooedcat

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Re: 'Ulcer' on Betta's head.
« Reply #4 on: February 01, 2015, 10:34:32 AM »
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Brilliant, I'll invest in one of those straight away. He's sat up by the heater as I type!

As I've been treating the tank with Melafix anyway, would you advise I continue with it for the time being?

Offline Sue

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Re: 'Ulcer' on Betta's head.
« Reply #5 on: February 01, 2015, 10:41:38 AM »
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I would avoid adding anything with -fix in the name as they aren't tolerated well by labyrinth fish such as bettas and gouramis. These products (melafix, pimafix and bettafix) have aromatic oils which can affect the labyrinth organ.

Lots of water changes to keep the water nice and clean are usually all that is needed. But do keep an eye on him.

If your carbon has been in the filter a while,it will be full and unless a medication is more strongly attracted to the carbon than what is already there the med won't be removed. It is new carbon that removes meds.
Is the carbon media all that is in there, eg in a cartridge? If it is just leave it there for ever, don't change it. That way it will be saturated so shouldn't remove medication and will home to all your bacteria.

Offline tattooedcat

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Re: 'Ulcer' on Betta's head.
« Reply #6 on: February 01, 2015, 11:05:58 AM »
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Ah okay, I didn't know that. I won't add any more Melafix!

The filter is one of these trickle filters in the hood. There are two cartridges in it, one side is ordinary sponge, the other is a carbon layer. In addition, I've added some ceramic beads and because the power head isn't adjustable I've also baffled the flow with bits of filter sponge in the intake and outflow. I did this because when I first brought him home he really struggled with the current. He has very heavy fins and being weak from being kept in a small cup in the shop, he was really getting dragged about poor lad.

Offline Sue

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Re: 'Ulcer' on Betta's head.
« Reply #7 on: February 01, 2015, 11:23:09 AM »
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Bettafix is even marketed for use with bettas  :o

If the sponge/carbon media is 2 layers glued together, it might be possible to tear them apart. The sponge half would work just as well on its own. Otherwise, just leave that bit of media in there permanently.

Offline tattooedcat

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Re: 'Ulcer' on Betta's head.
« Reply #8 on: February 01, 2015, 11:35:05 AM »
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Will do, and the heater guard is ordered! Fitting it should be entertaining as the heater slots through the hood and sits quite a distance from the sides of the tank.

Thanks all for putting my mind at rest a bit. I'll carry on and keep a close eye on him... which should be quite easy as he's not at all shy.  :)


Offline tattooedcat

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Re: 'Ulcer' on Betta's head.
« Reply #9 on: February 07, 2015, 05:39:05 PM »
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Hi again. Unfortunately, I'm back again with Jezza.

The heater guard is now fitted so that's all good but this patch on the little lad's head seems to be growing apace. It now extends to beyond his eyes and by the looks of it, he also has a couple of little spots on his back. He's also lost a bit of 'bustle' and although still eating, isn't scoffing with his usual enthusiasm. He also looks as though his body colour is getting a bit patchy. His platy girlfriends are both still chipper, no worries there at all.

I've done a bit of googling and have found a couple of cases similar to this in Bettas. Opinion has ranged from normal marbling to velvet and one of these cases also resulted in the unfortunate death of the fish.

I'd be really grateful for some input from experienced Betta owners because I'm totally at a loss here.

A couple more pics uploaded so you can compare to earlier ones.

Offline Sue

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Re: 'Ulcer' on Betta's head.
« Reply #10 on: February 07, 2015, 06:35:33 PM »
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I haven't had anything like that in all the bettas I've had over the years, so I am at a loss what to suggest.

I do know that marbles change patterning - my current betta was bought as a white and blue marble, but he only had white for a few weeks and he's been solid blue since then.

It shouldn't be velvet as that shows as a gold sheen rather than white.

From your photos it looks as though the scales are normal, just white; I think this rules out columnaris as I think the scales look as though there is something on them.

You say he is off his food a bit - have you been feeding just dried food? If you have, something like frozen bloodworm would be a treat for him - and if he is a bit picky with that, there is something not right.

Offline tattooedcat

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Re: 'Ulcer' on Betta's head.
« Reply #11 on: February 07, 2015, 07:25:23 PM »
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I usually feed him a little frozen bloodworm or daphnia scraped off the block and soak a couple of crumbled flakes in it. Sounds nuts I know but he refused to eat when I first had him and the bloodworm stew was the only thing I could tempt him with. I've carried it on because I'm paranoid about flake swelling in his tummy if I feed it to him dry. If I feed just the flake I soak it in a drop of his tank water for half an hour before I give it to him.

Like I said, he is still eating but not with his usual gusto. He's not starving himself by any means but there has been a subtle change in his behaviour. For instance, he's often sat at the front of the tank watching the world go by or sat up high up at the back by the heater. I haven't seen him doing that so much and he's spent much more time hiding in the plants. I don't know, maybe he's got the hump about the heater guard?!

Although I bought him from a very highly regarded fish shop, I don't know how old he was when I got him. I don't know what to expect with an ageing Betta and although I know they can lose colour as they age, I don't suppose it could be anything as dramatic as this?

Offline Fiona

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Re: 'Ulcer' on Betta's head.
« Reply #12 on: February 09, 2015, 01:08:15 PM »
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Maybe it could be age, bettas dont live that long sadly, 2-3 years is the norm. That said for your sake I hope not, I've fallen in love with my little guy and will be very sad when he goes. Fingers crossed whatever it is will get better.

Offline Sue

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Re: 'Ulcer' on Betta's head.
« Reply #13 on: February 09, 2015, 01:41:03 PM »
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It is almost 2 years since I got my betta (end of April) and he is beginning to show his age. He is spending more time lying on the bottom or wedged in plants.
Males are usually over six months when they are sold as it takes that long for their fins to grow to a saleable length. Bettas in shops are anything from 6 to 12 moths old.

Offline Fiona

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Re: 'Ulcer' on Betta's head.
« Reply #14 on: February 09, 2015, 02:03:56 PM »
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Thats why I made sure we picked one of the smallest in the shop, there were other prettier ones but some were almost twice Franks size

Offline tattooedcat

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Re: 'Ulcer' on Betta's head.
« Reply #15 on: February 09, 2015, 04:18:33 PM »
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If I'm being honest, I'm pretty certain I'm going to lose the little fella. He wouldn't come out of the plants to eat last night at all, not even when I put a little food in for the  platys. This morning he was waiting for his breakfast at least. I think he must have been really hungry because he seemed a bit keener than he has been of late.

Despite the good start this morning, he has been really quiet today, mostly wedged face down in the plants or laying on the gravel right at the back. He's not at all himself. His head now is completely white and his body is looking really patchy.

I just hope that this is not down to something that I've done wrong although I'd have thought if that were the case, problems would have been apparent way before now. One peculiar thing that did occur to me last night was that I've never ever seen him poo once in the four months I've had him. I can't help wondering if there's a connection.

Offline Sue

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Re: 'Ulcer' on Betta's head.
« Reply #16 on: February 09, 2015, 04:27:58 PM »
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Do you mean you've never seen him doing a poo or that you've never noticed any on the bottom of the tank?

I have had bettas for over 10 years (not the same one!) and I have never seen any of them actually doing it, though I know they must have because of what is on the bottom of the tank - it is easy to see with sand.

But bettas are not long lived fish, I think mainly due to the inbreeding to get those colours and tails. My current betta, at 21 months since purchase, is the longest lived I've had. The previous bettas have ranged from 10 days to 14 months.

Offline tattooedcat

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Re: 'Ulcer' on Betta's head.
« Reply #17 on: February 09, 2015, 05:01:46 PM »
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Both! My eyes aren't as good as they were and having a black substrate I struggle to see anything even vaguely resembling poo. I know it's in there though because the platys poo for England.

On a more serious note, if things get to the stage that his suffering means I have to intervene, what would be your advice regarding the best way to put him down? I've seen oil of cloves mentioned elsewhere and wondered if that would be suitable for a betta and if so, how to go about it. I hate having to ask but I suppose it's something that might have to be faced if he does deteriorate badly.

Offline Sue

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Re: 'Ulcer' on Betta's head.
« Reply #18 on: February 09, 2015, 05:28:08 PM »
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There are two ways to put a fish down. The easiest on the fish keeper is an overdose of anaesthetic eg clove oil. The other way is decapitation followed by pithing (ie destruction of the brain with a needle; this does mean knowing what you are doing)

Put the fish in a tub of tank water, enough to cover him. Put 20 to 25 drops clove oil in a screw top bottle or jar, add tapwater and shake. Then add to the tub with the fish. Wait a few hours before disposing of the body because if you remove the fish too soon, it might not be dead yet and come round.
Clove oil stinks. You won't be able to use the tub or bottle for anything else and be careful not to get it on your hands as it takes hours to get rid of.

Offline fishcake76

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Re: 'Ulcer' on Betta's head.
« Reply #19 on: February 09, 2015, 08:51:23 PM »
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Just a note regarding bettas and poo!!!

i read somewhere that a Betta will poo when it flares ( it evacuates it's system ready to fight, i assume?!)

I tried this with Stanley and he did most definitely poo when he flared. It was rather a large poo and quite hard so I think the poor chap had been constipated. He had been off his food for a while and had been hiding at the time too so might be worth showing him a mirror.

FC76

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