Tropical Fish Forum

Tropical Fish Keeping Help and Advice => New Fishkeepers => Topic started by: Alostangel on April 03, 2019, 01:03:20 PM

Title: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on April 03, 2019, 01:03:20 PM
So I’ve been looking into fish, specifically tropical. I’ve been doing some research and I’m thinking about a 64litre tank that’s 61cm long. I’ve got a budget of £100 but can spend a bit over. I’d really like lots of plants and decor in the tank, lots of hidey holes for the fish :) I was thinking about getting a Betta male and then also get 4 rainbow threadfins, 5 Zebra Danios, 7 Ember Tetra and an Otocinclus and was also looking at snails. Can anyone offer some advice on those fish combinations /on the plant front? What’s best, live or fake?
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Sue on April 03, 2019, 01:52:20 PM
Hi, welcome to the forum  :wave:

Lots of questions  :)

I'll start with the last one first. Live plants are better than fake ones. They don't have to be high-tech (that's the kind you read about injecting CO2 etc), low tech plants work just as well. These don't need fancy substrates or CO2 etc, just a bit of fertiliser. I'll come back to plants later.


Before getting any fish there are two things you need to do.

The first is find out how hard your tap water is. See if you can find that info on your water company's website. Ignore words light slightly soft, moderately hard etc and look for a number. We need that number and the unit, in full. There are half a dozen different units for hardness, but only two are used in fish keeping so we may have to convert your number.
The reason is that fish should be kept in water with a similar hardness to where they live in the wild. It is harmful to keep soft water fish in hard water and vice versa. Yes, water can be altered but it is not something I would recommend doing with your first tank.

The second is cycling the tank. This means growing the good bacteria that remove toxic chemicals from fish waste. The safest way for fish is a fishless cycle. The method for doing that is here https://forums.thinkfish.co.uk/fishtank-filtration-and-cycling/fishless-cycling-how-to-do-it/ If you do this method, get the plants once the cycle has finished as high doses of ammonia added in one go can harm plants. Fish may make the same amount but in tiny amounts all day long not in one dose.
There is an alternative - live plants. Fish make ammonia as their waste product and plants use ammonia as fertiliser. Unlike the good bacteria, plants do not turn it into nitrite. The way to use plants is to get a lot of them, not just the odd couple. Floating plants are best for this as they get lots of light being at the top of the tank, and they can get CO2 fro the air. These make floating plants grow faster and the faster they grow the more ammonia they need.
If you decide to go down this route, get your plants and wait a couple of weeks to make sure they are thriving. Then get fish a few at a time, and test for ammonia and nitrite every day. This is to make sure the plants are taking up all the ammonia. If you do see any ammonia and/or nitrite, a large water change will reduce them to a safer level. Once you know that the plants are coping with the first batch of fish - no ammonia for at least a week - get the next batch of fish, test for ammonia and nitrite daily; and so on till you have all your fish.



Fish selection.
Bettas are not community fish despite what a shop may tell you. They should be kept alone. Once you have got into fish keeping, you'll probably succumb to multi tank syndrome, an affliction of fish keepers, characterised by the desire for more and more tanks  ;D if this happens, think about a tank of around 25 litres for a betta.
Zebra danios may be small fish but they are incredibly fast swimmers and need a tank at least 100cm long, preferably more. They are also temperate fish, meaning they need cooler water than most tropical fish. I recommend you look round for something that doesn't need as much swimming room.
Threadfin rainbows are fine, though it does depend on your hardness. But you need at least 6 rather than 4. I should warn you that in the shops where I've seen these fish, they've only stocked males because they are the ones with the big fins and look prettier than females.
Neon tetras are also OK, if your hardness is right. Again, at least 6.
Otocinclus are also shoaling fish so you need at least 6 of those too. But they should not be added straight away; there must be algae in the tank for them to eat as many otos won't eat anything else.

Shoaling fish live in groups of hundreds in the wild. Their DNA is programmed to expect to be in a group and they will become stressed if there aren't enough of them. Stressed fish have lower immune systems and get sick more easily. It is thought that fish lose count at 6, which is why that is always the minimum number for shoaling fish - though always, more than 6 is better.





Got to go to the dentist - I'll add more later  ;D
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on April 03, 2019, 04:49:53 PM
Thank you for the help! I put those fish into the community creator and it didn’t pull up any major problems but glad I double checked!
I haven’t actually brought anything yet so glad about that. I got offered a tank and Betta by a friend of my mum’s (I’m only 17) but he said it was fairly small. Not sure what size but probably not 25litres. Should I just get my own tank for it?
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Sue on April 03, 2019, 06:41:14 PM
The absolute minimum for a betta is 2.5 American gallons which is 9.5 litres. 5 American gallons is much better, that's 19 litres. I've always used tanks around 25 litres. Have a look at the tank that your mum's friend has, measure it - there is a calculator in the menu at the top of the page you can use to work out the volume.
A lot of people keep bettas in unfiltered tanks, but this means daily water changes - or a lot of plants. If you do keep a betta, sponge filters powered by an air pump are ideal, as is this filter https://www.fishkeeper.co.uk/product/aqua-range-aqua-internal-50-filter because you can turn the flow rate down low.



Something I forgot to warn you about in my previous post - don't believe the shop. Any of them. So many shop workers are trained only in how to make a sale. They will say any rubbish to get you to buy something. Always check here first - we aren't trying to sell you anything  :)
The shop will probably either never have heard of fishless cycling or will tell you it's rubbish, just buy this miracle product and get all the fish you want now. Some of these bottled bacteria do actually work to speed up the cycle, but not if they've been stored incorrectly at any time since they left the factory.
And they probably have no idea about using plants to cycle a tank.



I won't suggest any other fish for your tank until you've told us how hard your water is. If you can't find it, tell us the name of the company and we'll see what we can do.



Plants. A lot of shops sell only a few plants. I've always resorted to on-line plant shopping to get what I want. Even Ebay sellers have a good range.
I have gone down a very low tech route. The vast majority of my plants are slow growing plants attached to pieces of wood (though they will attach to anything). I have java fern, several species of Anubias, Bolbitis, and Bucephalandra. I also have water sprite as a floating plant. I don't use CO2, I just use a plant fertiliser.
If you want plants that grow rooted in the substrate like land plants there are plenty of those too. But I'll have to leave those to other members as I have no experience with them.


I see you like snails. I have several nerite snails in my main tank. One you'll read about is apple snail, or mystery snails as the Americans call them, but the EU banned those a few years ago. Look at this thread for some ideas https://forums.thinkfish.co.uk/gallery-showcase/snail-photos/

Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: fcmf on April 04, 2019, 03:16:05 PM
Welcome to the forum!  :wave:

There's not much I would add to Sue's very helpful advice.  The fishless cycling process may sound daunting but Sue and others on here will keep you right as you go through the process.  As for snails, nerites come in a lovely range of colours - see https://www.pro-shrimp.co.uk/211-snails for some examples.  If you're happy to try live plants, then go for it, and there are plenty of advantages; if not, though, then there isn't actually anything wrong with fake plants as they provide the shelter and cover fish like, but I'd recommend silk ones over plastic ones - https://www.aquaoneonline.co.uk/silk-plants-361-c.asp, https://www.oase-livingwater.com/en_GB/indoor-aquatics/products/f/biorb-plant-sets.1000203451.html [the best ones with the fewest hard plastic bits on them are 46099, 46101 and 46102 product numbers], and https://hugokamishi.com/cat/001-hugo-kamishi-plant-collection/silk/ [the ones which have longest leaves and therefore fewer hard plastic parts].  Hope this is helpful.


Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Littlefish on April 04, 2019, 06:07:55 PM
Hi @Alostangel and welcome to the forum  :wave:

Great to hear that you are doing research before buying anything.  :cheers:

I use live plants in my tanks, all low tech set ups so I don't use CO2. Matt, one of our moderators, has great information on his site http://scapeeasy.co.uk/ and I'm sure he'll give you some advice on plants.
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on April 21, 2019, 11:05:27 AM
So I’ve now brought my tank. It’s a 64litre one, with a heater and lights, and a filter but I had to use one from a tank we brought a month or two ago for some tadpoles as the filter that came with my tank didn’t have the bracket to hang it in the tank! We’re going back tomorrow as shops are shut today to grab the missing piece. I washed the gravel, it’s a medium sized white gravel, and I’ve got a Captain Jack’s compass that bubbles which I need to grab some tubing for so that’s not in yet and I’ve got two live plants in there at the moment at the back (where the packet said they should go) and apparently the ones we brought grow really well. For water, I didn’t use tap water, instead my mum’s friend who helped us set up the tank got some dechlorinated water that’s meant for fish.
This is gonna sound bad but he advised me to get two cheap fish from the shop to put into the tank to begin with to get the tank settled, wondering what the opinion on this is?
The heater is set for 24°C at the moment but I saw on the cycling page it’s better to have it at 30°C for the bacteria to grow, so might change that later.
Wondering what you can advise I do next, will pick up some tester strips for the water when I go on monday as well.
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: pollydoodle on April 21, 2019, 02:13:30 PM
Alostangel,  Welcome.  this is a fantastic site for info.  I only got my tank last year and I'm always on here asking for advice
As someone who started with silk plants and now wants to change, read my earlier post today re substrate depth.  From experience It is much, much easier to get it right without fish than it is with fish swimming around   :fishy1: whilst trying to add gravel and position plants.

Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Littlefish on April 21, 2019, 02:48:46 PM
Fishless cycling is recommended, as it doesn't stress any fish, and would allow you to fully stock your tank with fish on completion.
https://forums.thinkfish.co.uk/fishtank-filtration-and-cycling/fishless-cycling-how-to-do-it/

What fish are you considering for your tank?
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Sue on April 21, 2019, 06:14:40 PM
I would forget the special water your mum's friend gave you because once you have fish you will need to change half the water every week, and buying water works out expensive. It also means you can't do an emergency water change if you have no bought water to hand. It is much better to use your tap water and add dechlorinator to that. The best one is API Tap Water Conditioner which uses 1 drop per American gallon of new water - that's 1 drop per 3.75 litres. A small bottle lasts a long time.

If you can, get a test kit with liquid reagents and test tubes, they are better than strips. Most strips do not test for ammonia so you have to buy a separate tester for that.



Most shops don't have a clue about fish. Never take any notice of what they say. Most of them are trained only in how to make a sale, and to make up anything to get that sale. On the other hand, we are not trying to sell you anything, and we have a lot of experience between all the members  :) Don't tell her I said so, but be careful about believing what your Mum's friend tells you as well. It is possible she goes by what the shop tells her - for instance, using tap water is the best way to go.

While you are cycling the tank you have plenty time to research fish. The first thing you need to do is find out how hard your water is. Ask your parents for the name of your water company, and either look the hardness up on their website, or ask one of us to do it.
There are fish that have evolved in hard water so they must be kept in hard water, and fish which have evolved in soft water so need to be kept in soft water. You need to know what type you have so you can chose fish that will be happy in your tank.
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on April 28, 2019, 11:03:41 AM
Fishless cycling is recommended, as it doesn't stress any fish, and would allow you to fully stock your tank with fish on completion.
https://forums.thinkfish.co.uk/fishtank-filtration-and-cycling/fishless-cycling-how-to-do-it/

What fish are you considering for your tank?

I was having a play with the community creator and was thinking maybe 7 neon tetras, 7 harlequins and 6 salt and pepper Corys. Opinions on this set up?
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on April 28, 2019, 11:04:41 AM
Alostangel,  Welcome.  this is a fantastic site for info.  I only got my tank last year and I'm always on here asking for advice
As someone who started with silk plants and now wants to change, read my earlier post today re substrate depth.  From experience It is much, much easier to get it right without fish than it is with fish swimming around   :fishy1: whilst trying to add gravel and position plants.
So I need soil to get my plants to grow? I have medium sized gravel at the moment, I’d say at probably a 1 inch depth?
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on April 28, 2019, 11:08:24 AM
I would forget the special water your mum's friend gave you because once you have fish you will need to change half the water every week, and buying water works out expensive. It also means you can't do an emergency water change if you have no bought water to hand. It is much better to use your tap water and add dechlorinator to that. The best one is API Tap Water Conditioner which uses 1 drop per American gallon of new water - that's 1 drop per 3.75 litres. A small bottle lasts a long time.

If you can, get a test kit with liquid reagents and test tubes, they are better than strips. Most strips do not test for ammonia so you have to buy a separate tester for that.



Most shops don't have a clue about fish. Never take any notice of what they say. Most of them are trained only in how to make a sale, and to make up anything to get that sale. On the other hand, we are not trying to sell you anything, and we have a lot of experience between all the members  :) Don't tell her I said so, but be careful about believing what your Mum's friend tells you as well. It is possible she goes by what the shop tells her - for instance, using tap water is the best way to go.

While you are cycling the tank you have plenty time to research fish. The first thing you need to do is find out how hard your water is. Ask your parents for the name of your water company, and either look the hardness up on their website, or ask one of us to do it.
There are fish that have evolved in hard water so they must be kept in hard water, and fish which have evolved in soft water so need to be kept in soft water. You need to know what type you have so you can chose fish that will be happy in your tank.
Kinda struggling as I’m being told all this info and trying to do it but my parents are just telling me to shove some fish in and get on with it really. Would like to do it right but it’s hard when my mum is pushing me to do it her way if you understand?
But I know for a fact my tap water is very hard. To the point where we filter the water before it goes in the kettle and we still have to descale it relatively often. Am I right in saying tetras, harlequins and Corys want soft water?
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on April 28, 2019, 11:11:24 AM
Another thing, can I add pictures to here that I’ve taken on my phone? Might make it a bit easier for you to see what I’ve got and what to do with it.
Oh and I also brought a couple of small bits of wood, planning on soaking them in a bucket of water as I saw a couple of people on here struggled with their water turning cloudy if they put them straight in
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Sue on April 28, 2019, 12:34:30 PM
You are right, the fish you name all need soft water.
Have a look at endlers. They need hard water and are lovely little fish. But males only as they breed like rabbits and you'd need at least 3 females for every male which soon means more endlers than you can cope with. They come in several different colours and patterns. A tank with a dozen or so mixed pattern male endlers would look stunning.
(The reason you need a lot more females than males is because like all livebearers, males chase females constantly. With more females, each female gets time out while the males chase another female)

Make sure you use straight tap water, not water from a filter. Some replace the hardness minerals with hydrogen ions. pH is the measure of hydrogen ions, an upside down measure. So if you add a lot more hydrogen ions, the pH drops. My old Brita filter dropped my pH from 7.5 to off the bottom off the scale so less than 6. Other types of filter replace the hardness minerals with sodium, and lots of sodium is not good for fish.

You do not need soil for plants, sand or fine gravel is fine. But you need deeper than 1 inch if you intend plants rooted in the substrate.
The alternative is to use plants that grow attached to decor. That's all I have in my tanks.

A lot of wood floats at first. Soaking it in a bucket gets it water logged so it sinks. It also allows the worst of the brown tannins to leach out.
And wood is ideal for attaching plants to  ;)




I know what you mean about your mother. My husband thinks I'm mad the way I treat my fish  ;D The only thing you can do is to tell her that fish are living creatures and they must be treated with respect. This means making their home as good as you can, which means getting the tank suitable for them. More fish die from water problems than any other cause.
Your Mum's way is probably based on old time thinking, or based on what shop workers say. We now know that all lot of old information is not correct, and it is well known that shop workers haven't a clue.




Re the photos, I'll have to let someone else help with that. Do you have access to a computer to down load your photos to? I upload photos from my laptop, which is easy. I have no idea how you do it from a phone  :-[




Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on April 28, 2019, 06:52:19 PM
You are right, the fish you name all need soft water.
Have a look at endlers. They need hard water and are lovely little fish. But males only as they breed like rabbits and you'd need at least 3 females for every male which soon means more endlers than you can cope with. They come in several different colours and patterns. A tank with a dozen or so mixed pattern male endlers would look stunning.
(The reason you need a lot more females than males is because like all livebearers, males chase females constantly. With more females, each female gets time out while the males chase another female)

Make sure you use straight tap water, not water from a filter. Some replace the hardness minerals with hydrogen ions. pH is the measure of hydrogen ions, an upside down measure. So if you add a lot more hydrogen ions, the pH drops. My old Brita filter dropped my pH from 7.5 to off the bottom off the scale so less than 6. Other types of filter replace the hardness minerals with sodium, and lots of sodium is not good for fish.

You do not need soil for plants, sand or fine gravel is fine. But you need deeper than 1 inch if you intend plants rooted in the substrate.
The alternative is to use plants that grow attached to decor. That's all I have in my tanks.

A lot of wood floats at first. Soaking it in a bucket gets it water logged so it sinks. It also allows the worst of the brown tannins to leach out.
And wood is ideal for attaching plants to  ;)




I know what you mean about your mother. My husband thinks I'm mad the way I treat my fish  ;D The only thing you can do is to tell her that fish are living creatures and they must be treated with respect. This means making their home as good as you can, which means getting the tank suitable for them. More fish die from water problems than any other cause.
Your Mum's way is probably based on old time thinking, or based on what shop workers say. We now know that all lot of old information is not correct, and it is well known that shop workers haven't a clue.




Re the photos, I'll have to let someone else help with that. Do you have access to a computer to down load your photos to? I upload photos from my laptop, which is easy. I have no idea how you do it from a phone  :-[

So I should go and get another bag of gravel then for the tank?

Yeah, she keeps pushing me to get some fish. Pretty sure I’m gonna end up with fish on Tuesday whether I like it or not tbh. I was trying to explain soft vs hard water and the different pHs to her and her view of it was that I’m ‘looking into it too much’. I said about getting the water tested because she said we’d get some fish from pets at home while we’re near one on Tuesday (not sure about pets at home for fish but that’s another issue entirely) and she said not to bother with testing the water until a month after the fish go in there which is how the soft, hard water and pH conversation came up. My plan is that I’m gonna have a fish who likes soft water and a fish that likes hard water in my idea and I’ll go with whichever my water comes out as.

I do have a laptop, I’ll try on there :)
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on April 28, 2019, 07:06:35 PM
I think the file is too big :/ any ideas on how to get around that? (Not by breaking the rules of course but is there something I'm doing aha)
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Sue on April 28, 2019, 07:38:45 PM
Does the laptop have the app Paint installed? (If it's anything like my Windows 10 laptop, you have to do a search to find it!) You can resize the photo using that. Home -> image -> resize. You can reduce the percentage while keeping the aspect ration the same.

Edit - I've just had a play with one of my photos. I used resize in Paint and changed the % from 100 to 80 keeping the aspect the same. This reduced the image size from 1.44 MB to 842 KB.
In the box under the reply box on here it says the max size for any one image is 3000 KB (or 3 MB), so as long as your image is less than that it will attach.
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Sue on April 28, 2019, 08:15:49 PM
Forgot to add - don't believe anything anyone tells you at Pets at Home. I read a post on another forum by someone who worked there. He said they are not trained in how to care for fish or which fish go together; they are trained to work from a sheet and to make something up, anything, so that the customer buys something. Staff who keep fish themselves are usually assigned to any section other than fish. The staff assigned to the fish section either have no pets or they keep dogs or rabbits or anything that is not a fish. Fish keeping members of staff are not allowed to help a customer by telling them something not on the 'sheet'.

Several years ago I wanted to buy a male/female pair of dwarf gouramis. I read up on them first and asked for a stripey one (male) and a plain one (female). The chap serving me insisted that the pale blue ones were the females, and he refused to give me what I knew was a female. At the checkout, I said that I was sure I'd been given 2 males; the woman looked at them and agreed with me, and told me to go back and make him change one. If I hadn't done my research I would have come home with two  males of one of the more aggressive species of gourami which would soon have resulted in one dead fish. The chap on the fish section hadn't a clue.
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on April 28, 2019, 10:07:19 PM
Forgot to add - don't believe anything anyone tells you at Pets at Home. I read a post on another forum by someone who worked there. He said they are not trained in how to care for fish or which fish go together; they are trained to work from a sheet and to make something up, anything, so that the customer buys something. Staff who keep fish themselves are usually assigned to any section other than fish. The staff assigned to the fish section either have no pets or they keep dogs or rabbits or anything that is not a fish. Fish keeping members of staff are not allowed to help a customer by telling them something not on the 'sheet'.

Several years ago I wanted to buy a male/female pair of dwarf gouramis. I read up on them first and asked for a stripey one (male) and a plain one (female). The chap serving me insisted that the pale blue ones were the females, and he refused to give me what I knew was a female. At the checkout, I said that I was sure I'd been given 2 males; the woman looked at them and agreed with me, and told me to go back and make him change one. If I hadn't done my research I would have come home with two  males of one of the more aggressive species of gourami which would soon have resulted in one dead fish. The chap on the fish section hadn't a clue.

Yeah, that doesn’t sound great... I was against them more because I’ve heard a lot of stories about fish becoming ill once you get them home so was gonna avoid them more for that reason but my mum is adamant that you’ll ‘get that anywhere you go’
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Sue on April 29, 2019, 04:57:36 PM
Do you have a Maidenhead Aquatics nearby? They are often in garden centres, which may please your Mum. She can go round all the stuff they sell these days while you go to look at the fish. Their fish are usually better quality.

And they sell endlers........

https://www.fishkeeper.co.uk/storefinder
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on April 30, 2019, 10:20:27 AM
Do you have a Maidenhead Aquatics nearby? They are often in garden centres, which may please your Mum. She can go round all the stuff they sell these days while you go to look at the fish. Their fish are usually better quality.

And they sell endlers........

https://www.fishkeeper.co.uk/storefinder

I have one but it’s not all too near where we’ll be tonight, when my mum is determined for me to get some fish aha. Her view of it is just that it’s a fish and shouldn’t require too much effort. Doesn’t help that her friend just works on that basis too I think.
There’s a shop up slightly near me that we could get them from that is apparently (sceptical of course) really good so I might get some from them from there but since we’re near the pets at home she might just take me there
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Sue on April 30, 2019, 01:37:14 PM
You could always not like the fish they have or "see something wrong with them" eg that one in the corner looks a bit iffy and if that one is sick the whole tank has probably already caught it and I don't want to buy fish that might be sick. Just because the rest look healthy doesn't mean they are not infected! (eg my 3 year old granddaughter was a bit off, then suddenly came out in chickenpox spots. She'd been incubating it for a few days)
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on April 30, 2019, 04:46:09 PM
You could always not like the fish they have or "see something wrong with them" eg that one in the corner looks a bit iffy and if that one is sick the whole tank has probably already caught it and I don't want to buy fish that might be sick. Just because the rest look healthy doesn't mean they are not infected! (eg my 3 year old granddaughter was a bit off, then suddenly came out in chickenpox spots. She'd been incubating it for a few days)
Hadn’t thought of that! Will definitely try that one, or try the ‘spot the dead fish’ game that is apparently common place in Pets At Home :/
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on May 02, 2019, 04:02:19 PM
You are right, the fish you name all need soft water.
Have a look at endlers. They need hard water and are lovely little fish. But males only as they breed like rabbits and you'd need at least 3 females for every male which soon means more endlers than you can cope with. They come in several different colours and patterns. A tank with a dozen or so mixed pattern male endlers would look stunning.
(The reason you need a lot more females than males is because like all livebearers, males chase females constantly. With more females, each female gets time out while the males chase another female)

Make sure you use straight tap water, not water from a filter. Some replace the hardness minerals with hydrogen ions. pH is the measure of hydrogen ions, an upside down measure. So if you add a lot more hydrogen ions, the pH drops. My old Brita filter dropped my pH from 7.5 to off the bottom off the scale so less than 6. Other types of filter replace the hardness minerals with sodium, and lots of sodium is not good for fish.

You do not need soil for plants, sand or fine gravel is fine. But you need deeper than 1 inch if you intend plants rooted in the substrate.
The alternative is to use plants that grow attached to decor. That's all I have in my tanks.

A lot of wood floats at first. Soaking it in a bucket gets it water logged so it sinks. It also allows the worst of the brown tannins to leach out.
And wood is ideal for attaching plants to  ;)




I know what you mean about your mother. My husband thinks I'm mad the way I treat my fish  ;D The only thing you can do is to tell her that fish are living creatures and they must be treated with respect. This means making their home as good as you can, which means getting the tank suitable for them. More fish die from water problems than any other cause.
Your Mum's way is probably based on old time thinking, or based on what shop workers say. We now know that all lot of old information is not correct, and it is well known that shop workers haven't a clue.




Re the photos, I'll have to let someone else help with that. Do you have access to a computer to down load your photos to? I upload photos from my laptop, which is easy. I have no idea how you do it from a phone  :-[

So I’ve been soaking the wood for 4 days now I believe and there’s still bits coming off them but the water isn’t turning brown. I got two pieces and one bit now sinks but the other still floats. Wondering if this is normal or if I’m doing something wrong or if it’s the wrong shape or something?
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Sue on May 02, 2019, 04:18:11 PM
It all depends on what the wood is. Bogwood tends to leach tannins, while redmoor doesn't, for example. There are lots of other types of wood as well.

How fast a piece of wood gets waterlogged and sinks also depends on the type of the wood, and the size and shape. Thin bits of wood sink faster than blocks, simple because the water has less distance to go to reach right inside. I had a piece of wood a couple of years ago which took 3 weeks to sink. I was beginning to think it would never sink  :)
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on May 02, 2019, 08:38:29 PM
It all depends on what the wood is. Bogwood tends to leach tannins, while redmoor doesn't, for example. There are lots of other types of wood as well.

How fast a piece of wood gets waterlogged and sinks also depends on the type of the wood, and the size and shape. Thin bits of wood sink faster than blocks, simple because the water has less distance to go to reach right inside. I had a piece of wood a couple of years ago which took 3 weeks to sink. I was beginning to think it would never sink  :)

So in other words stick with it aha. Should I put the piece that’s sinking in now or wait until they both sink to put them in? Figuring there’s no harm in soaking it for extra time?
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Sue on May 02, 2019, 09:21:34 PM
The one that's already sunk needs to stay wet. If it dries out it will need soaking again. I have several bits of wood in a box and if I decide to use a bit, I have to soak it again before I can use it.
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on May 02, 2019, 09:23:50 PM
The one that's already sunk needs to stay wet. If it dries out it will need soaking again. I have several bits of wood in a box and if I decide to use a bit, I have to soak it again before I can use it.
Yeah, I was gonna keep it in with the other piece. At the moment I’m putting it on top in an attempt to keep the floating piece down but was wondering if it should go in the tank now while I soak the other piece or just keep soaking and go in when the other piece is also ready
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Sue on May 02, 2019, 09:33:04 PM
You can put it in the tank whenever you want. Some people put wood straight in the tank and use rocks to weight it down till it's waterlogged. I find it easier in a bucket but then if I tried the rock trick, knowing me it would fall off and squish a fish  :-\
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on May 02, 2019, 09:48:25 PM
You can put it in the tank whenever you want. Some people put wood straight in the tank and use rocks to weight it down till it's waterlogged. I find it easier in a bucket but then if I tried the rock trick, knowing me it would fall off and squish a fish  :-\

Aha, I probably would too.

Also, I ended up getting 6 Harlequin Rasbora on Tuesday night. I know it’s a fair few but from what I understand putting more fish into an already established shoal isn’t easy plus they wanted to be in groups anyways so I thought it would be less stressful on them to get the 6. They seem to be doing pretty well, I floated them in the water for the best part of an hour before introducing some of the water into the bag they were in then leaving for 15 minutes then putting them in. They seem alright, I fed them a bit of food yesterday morning and they ate that quickly. I fed them again this morning and think I put a bit too much in but they ate it all. Tomorrow I won’t put as much in.

So far I’ve been doing white light on during the day, then blue light when I’m getting ready for bed/about an hour before then turning the light off when I do go to bed. My dad offered to help me set it up to be on a timer and I’m wondering what the best cycle for the lighting would be. Do I need the blue light? What purpose does it serve?
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Sue on May 02, 2019, 10:03:21 PM
Shoaling fish do better when you get the whole shoal at once. Harlequins also like some cover, of the sort provided by floating plants. I have the closely related Espe's rasboras and until I got some floating plants they just hid in the back corner.

Keep an eye on your ammonia level, and if it shows above zero, do a water change. If you do get ammonia showing up, check nitrite as well. That will only start a week or two after ammonia.



Lights should come on at least an hour after the curtains are opened/the room light is turned on, and at the other end either turn off an hour before it goes dark/leave the room light on for at least an hour after tank lights off. This is because of the way fish eyes work, they need a transition period of an hour between total darkness and full tank lights. That doesn't mean to have them on all that time, just avoid sudden lights on or sudden lights off whenever you have the lights on.
Fish also need the lights to be on for the same duration every day, and at the same time every day, so a timer is perfect for this - just set it for the same every day.

You don't need the blue light, though if they can be set on a different timer from the white lights, you can have them set to come on just as the white lights turn off. maybe a 5 minute overlap just in case the timers aren't in synch.

As for duration, if there are no live plants, then as long as you want, but remember that the longer the lights are on with a plantless tank the more algae that will grow.
With live plants, try 6 hours a day to start with. if the plants starts to suffer from lack of light, increase by an hour. If algae starts to go mad, try an hour less.
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on May 03, 2019, 06:43:08 AM
Shoaling fish do better when you get the whole shoal at once. Harlequins also like some cover, of the sort provided by floating plants. I have the closely related Espe's rasboras and until I got some floating plants they just hid in the back corner.

Keep an eye on your ammonia level, and if it shows above zero, do a water change. If you do get ammonia showing up, check nitrite as well. That will only start a week or two after ammonia.



Lights should come on at least an hour after the curtains are opened/the room light is turned on, and at the other end either turn off an hour before it goes dark/leave the room light on for at least an hour after tank lights off. This is because of the way fish eyes work, they need a transition period of an hour between total darkness and full tank lights. That doesn't mean to have them on all that time, just avoid sudden lights on or sudden lights off whenever you have the lights on.
Fish also need the lights to be on for the same duration every day, and at the same time every day, so a timer is perfect for this - just set it for the same every day.

You don't need the blue light, though if they can be set on a different timer from the white lights, you can have them set to come on just as the white lights turn off. maybe a 5 minute overlap just in case the timers aren't in synch.

As for duration, if there are no live plants, then as long as you want, but remember that the longer the lights are on with a plantless tank the more algae that will grow.
With live plants, try 6 hours a day to start with. if the plants starts to suffer from lack of light, increase by an hour. If algae starts to go mad, try an hour less.

Mine don’t seem shy, I’ve seen them swimming everywhere. One or two even ventured down to the bottom. Does this mean they’re stressed or just extroverted?

I’ll see about putting it on a timer this weekend hopefully - it can be my dad’s little DIY project aha. I’ve been putting the white light on at roughly 7, then opening my curtains just before I leave, about 10 to 8. Then it stays on until between 7-9, then has blue light for a few hours until I go to sleep at about 10:30pm. I’ve noticed there’s a bit of algae but since I would like to get some algae eaters, I figured it would be good for there to be some in the tank already?
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Sue on May 03, 2019, 09:22:47 AM
Then it stays on until between 7-9, then has blue light for a few hours until I go to sleep at about 10:30pm.

Please make sure the curtains have been opened (or the room light on) for an hour before turning the tank light on. It harms the fish if the tank light is turned on in a dark room, their eyes are not designed to cope with this. And they must also be in non-tank light for an hour after the tank lights turn off - either daylight or room light.
There is a very good explanation of why in another forum, but I'm not allowed to give links to rival forums, and I can't copy it here for copyright reasons  :-\ I'll have to write a paraphrased version, though it could take some time as it's quite long.



I read somewhere, though I can't find it now, that blue light causes algae. But other sources say that plants need red and blue light to grow properly.
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Sue on May 03, 2019, 09:34:48 AM
Forgot to say....

If the algae eaters you want are otos, please be aware they can starve to death. They are usually on the point of starvation by the time they arrive at the shop due to not being fed properly since they were caught. With otos, once they go past a certain point, no matter how much food they have they'll still die. The way to buy them is to wait until they've been in the shop a couple of weeks so that the ones that are going to die will already have done so. Choose fish with rounded but not bloated bellies. Many of them won't touch algae pellets or wafers till they learn it is food, and some never will. Since they need to be in a shoal of at least 6, that's a fair amount of algae that they'll need. One way to feed them is to put some small rocks in a glass container of water on a sunny window ledge. Algae will grow on the rocks. Put one rock in the tank and when the algae is all gone use another and put the clean one back in the container of water to grow more.
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on May 05, 2019, 08:38:40 AM
Then it stays on until between 7-9, then has blue light for a few hours until I go to sleep at about 10:30pm.

Please make sure the curtains have been opened (or the room light on) for an hour before turning the tank light on. It harms the fish if the tank light is turned on in a dark room, their eyes are not designed to cope with this. And they must also be in non-tank light for an hour after the tank lights turn off - either daylight or room light.
There is a very good explanation of why in another forum, but I'm not allowed to give links to rival forums, and I can't copy it here for copyright reasons  :-\ I'll have to write a paraphrased version, though it could take some time as it's quite long.



I read somewhere, though I can't find it now, that blue light causes algae. But other sources say that plants need red and blue light to grow properly.

I’ll open the curtains now before and shut the lights off before it gets dark then! Hopefully it will get better once I have them on a timer - my dad’s gonna look at it for me today if he can to see how easily and quickly it can be done since it’s on the same plug as the filter.
I’ll scrap the idea of the blue light then and I’ll do the rock idea you suggested in your other post. I’ll also do as you suggested and go back to the shop after a few weeks to see which ones are dead, which ones are still ok.
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on May 05, 2019, 09:40:13 AM
Also, I’ve noticed some bubbles appearing at the surface of the water. I’m not sure if this is just the filter or if it’s the fish or if it’s something else? I’ve got the two plants but nothing else I can think of that would make the bubbles.
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Sue on May 05, 2019, 10:29:37 AM
The timer could be a problem if the filter runs off the same cable. What about the heater, is that the same cable too?

The only way you can use a timer is to wire the lights differently, which would mean unplugging everything, disconnecting the wire for the lights from the mains cable, then going into the light itself and fitting a new mains cable.


Why on earth to they make tanks like this. Filters and heaters need to be switched on 24/7. Lights don't but they should be switched on for the same duration at the same time of day, every days. Our lifestyles mean we can be there at exactly the same day every single day of the year to turn the lights on and off.
Sorry, rant over.


I have written a post, paraphrasing the one on the other forum, about tank lights. https://forums.thinkfish.co.uk/new-fishkeepers/tank-lights-how-they-affect-fish/




You haven't got a betta or gourami that you've not mentioned, have you  ;D They blow bubble nests.
Did you set the tank us just before getting fish - it could be bubbles from the substrate.
Other than that, I don't know........
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on May 05, 2019, 02:15:43 PM
The timer could be a problem if the filter runs off the same cable. What about the heater, is that the same cable too?

The only way you can use a timer is to wire the lights differently, which would mean unplugging everything, disconnecting the wire for the lights from the mains cable, then going into the light itself and fitting a new mains cable.


Why on earth to they make tanks like this. Filters and heaters need to be switched on 24/7. Lights don't but they should be switched on for the same duration at the same time of day, every days. Our lifestyles mean we can be there at exactly the same day every single day of the year to turn the lights on and off.
Sorry, rant over.


I have written a post, paraphrasing the one on the other forum, about tank lights. https://forums.thinkfish.co.uk/new-fishkeepers/tank-lights-how-they-affect-fish/




You haven't got a betta or gourami that you've not mentioned, have you  ;D They blow bubble nests.
Did you set the tank us just before getting fish - it could be bubbles from the substrate.
Other than that, I don't know........

So the heater is on a different plug and the filter is always on, the lights are actually controlled independently with some buttons.

The heater is currently set to 26°C which I believe is a happy temperature for the harlequins. And the light that says the water is the wrong temperature isn’t on so it should be the right temperature.

I’ll look at the lights post in a second, thank you for the time it took!

I haven’t got a Betta or gourami hidden away aha! I know that Bettas blow bubble nests as my mum’s friend had a pair (in separate tanks) and the male blew a bubble nest.

The substrate was in the tank for about 9-10 days before I got my 6 harlequins and I had washed it before it went in. Hadn’t noticed anything about the bubbles until a few days ago. My piece of wood is still floating too I believe :)
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Sue on May 05, 2019, 06:31:21 PM
If the wood is still floating, it isn't yet waterlogged and could have air inside. As the water penetrates further it will push out the air, which may be where the bubbles are coming from.

Using a thermometer is the best way to set the temperature as heater settings are notoriously inaccurate. The best kind of thermometer is the one which goes inside the tank and has liquid moving up and down the scale, or more expensively, a digital thermometer with a probe that goes in the water. The kind that stick on the outside and change colour are not as accurate as air temperature affects them.

26 deg is a bit high. Harlequins' range is 21 to 28 deg, and we should aim for the middle of that so around 24 to 25 is better. There is an article somewhere which thinks that we keep our fish too warm - I'll see if I can find it.......






........found it! http://www.seriouslyfish.com/whaddaya-mean-too-hot/
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on May 05, 2019, 09:31:04 PM
If the wood is still floating, it isn't yet waterlogged and could have air inside. As the water penetrates further it will push out the air, which may be where the bubbles are coming from.

Using a thermometer is the best way to set the temperature as heater settings are notoriously inaccurate. The best kind of thermometer is the one which goes inside the tank and has liquid moving up and down the scale, or more expensively, a digital thermometer with a probe that goes in the water. The kind that stick on the outside and change colour are not as accurate as air temperature affects them.

26 deg is a bit high. Harlequins' range is 21 to 28 deg, and we should aim for the middle of that so around 24 to 25 is better. There is an article somewhere which thinks that we keep our fish too warm - I'll see if I can find it.......






........found it! http://www.seriouslyfish.com/whaddaya-mean-too-hot/

The wood is in a bucket in my garage, not in the tank aha. I decided not to put one bit in just because I don’t see the point in stressing them out twice when it could be once.

I’ll give the article a read and turn the heater down to 25° just before I go to sleep!

Also, is music and my singing likely to stress them out or panic them? I’m not a great singer aha but wondering because it’s not that quiet but definitely not what I would Class as loud.
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on May 09, 2019, 03:57:30 PM
So, I’m happy to report that all 6 Harlequins are still alive! My wood is almost to the point of sinking and my fish seem to be shoaling. One is quite a bit brighter than the others but from what I understand, they form their pecking order through who’s the most colourful. I’ll edit this bit to show what they’re being fed. I’m feeding them two half scoops each feed, twice a day. They already seen to know that my lifting the feeding flap means food! I’m wondering if I’m feeding too much or too little. I don’t want them to become overweight but equally, would feel awful if I’m under feeding.
My plants are also growing well and one is now over the top of the water which it wasn’t before! I’ll edit some pictures tonight to be able to upload them as a before I got the fish and after. I’m already quite attached to my little guys (still not sure on their genders) and can quite happily imagine filling my tank with just them!
Thought I’d give a bit of an update, let you know how they’re getting on :)
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Sue on May 09, 2019, 04:20:37 PM
It is very easy to over feed. I have Espei's rasboras, a closely related species to harlequins (look at slender harlequin rasboras in the fish profiles). I find mine only eat food from the water; once it has sunk to the bottom they ignore it. Make sure that all the food you give is eaten before it has chance to sink. if any does reach the bottom, use less food. And I only feed this tank once a day.
Fish need less food than you'd think. We use most of our food to make heat. Fish don't do this as they get their heat from the water. And fish can go for over a week without food (except possibly tiny baby fish which need more food)


With a couple of exceptions, freshwater fish only go together as a group when they are stressed. Happy fish spread out all over the tank. Stress can come from being new to the tank and still settling in. My rasboras huddled together until I got some floating plants because they do not like bright light overhead, another possible cause of yours swimming together. Most of the fish from the Amazon and similar habitats in Asia come from waters with overhanging trees which shade the fish from direct light. This includes all the rasboras which look similar to harlequins.



Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on May 09, 2019, 05:16:28 PM
It is very easy to over feed. I have Espei's rasboras, a closely related species to harlequins (look at slender harlequin rasboras in the fish profiles). I find mine only eat food from the water; once it has sunk to the bottom they ignore it. Make sure that all the food you give is eaten before it has chance to sink. if any does reach the bottom, use less food. And I only feed this tank once a day.
Fish need less food than you'd think. We use most of our food to make heat. Fish don't do this as they get their heat from the water. And fish can go for over a week without food (except possibly tiny baby fish which need more food)


With a couple of exceptions, freshwater fish only go together as a group when they are stressed. Happy fish spread out all over the tank. Stress can come from being new to the tank and still settling in. My rasboras huddled together until I got some floating plants because they do not like bright light overhead, another possible cause of yours swimming together. Most of the fish from the Amazon and similar habitats in Asia come from waters with overhanging trees which shade the fish from direct light. This includes all the rasboras which look similar to harlequins.

I knew they were tricking me, fat boys aha. I'll try feeding once a day from now on!
They had just been fed when shoaling so wondering if that was the cause? They also seemed to be congregating around the heater.
I have actually seen them go down and get the one or two bits of food that has managed to float down to the bottom but those pieces just seem to sink as soon as I put them in. They're tiny flakes though, pretty sure they're made for tetras and similar sized fish.
I'll try and get some floating plants to go in my tank, need to do some research on which ones!
Another thing, are otos the best algae eaters or am I better to go for something else? Not such a fan of the idea of shrimp though...
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Sue on May 09, 2019, 06:53:54 PM
You don't need algae eaters. It is much better to discover the cause of algae and correct it. Having said that, it is virtually unknown for a tank to have no algae whatsoever; the trick is to keep it under control.

If you like otos for themselves, by all means get some, but bear in mind that they need to be in a shoal of at least 6 and a tank that can grow enough algae to feed a whole shoal.


There are no creatures which eat every type of algae; and there are some types of algae that nothing eats. One of the best algae eaters is nerite snails. They come in various sizes, and the smaller types can get into tight spaces we might miss when cleaning a tank. You can see mine in this thread, though some have died in the three years since I started the thread (one #1, #2 and #3). https://forums.thinkfish.co.uk/gallery-showcase/snail-photos/
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on May 09, 2019, 10:49:57 PM
You don't need algae eaters. It is much better to discover the cause of algae and correct it. Having said that, it is virtually unknown for a tank to have no algae whatsoever; the trick is to keep it under control.

If you like otos for themselves, by all means get some, but bear in mind that they need to be in a shoal of at least 6 and a tank that can grow enough algae to feed a whole shoal.


There are no creatures which eat every type of algae; and there are some types of algae that nothing eats. One of the best algae eaters is nerite snails. They come in various sizes, and the smaller types can get into tight spaces we might miss when cleaning a tank. You can see mine in this thread, though some have died in the three years since I started the thread (one #1, #2 and #3). https://forums.thinkfish.co.uk/gallery-showcase/snail-photos/
I’m worrying now that my tank isn’t big/well planted enough for otos to do well in... I might get some nerite snails first and build up my plants and other such stuff as well as collecting some pebbles and rocks, etc. for algae if I do decide to get some otos and also for some decor in the tank.

Also, I found out the picture of the tank is just over 2.5mb so should fit into the attachments but still won’t for some reason.
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on May 12, 2019, 05:04:11 PM
Also, while I was out at my dad’s my mum/her friend got me a thermometer. It sticks on the side of the tank in the water (side furthest away from my heater) and digitally displays the temperature. I still can’t seem to upload the pictures, despite them being less than 3000kb...
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Sue on May 12, 2019, 05:10:28 PM
As long as the probe goes in the water it should be fine. It is the stick on the outside ones that are not terribly accurate.


How are you trying to upload pics? Are you getting a message saying that they won't upload because they are too big, or whatever reason?
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on May 13, 2019, 06:19:59 AM
As long as the probe goes in the water it should be fine. It is the stick on the outside ones that are not terribly accurate.


How are you trying to upload pics? Are you getting a message saying that they won't upload because they are too big, or whatever reason?

I’ve tried from both my phone and my laptop and get the same error message, saying it can’t upload because the files are too big or they took too long to upload
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Sue on May 13, 2019, 12:17:54 PM
I just tried attaching a large photo (3.54 MB) and I got the error message because it is over 3.0 MB (ie 3000 KB)

Have you tried resizing the photos? Most laptops come with Paint already installed, right click on the photo, down to 'open with' and select Paint.
If you can find Paint on your laptop, I can tell you how to resize a photo to make it smaller - that is, fewer MB.
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on May 13, 2019, 03:53:53 PM
I just tried attaching a large photo (3.54 MB) and I got the error message because it is over 3.0 MB (ie 3000 KB)

Have you tried resizing the photos? Most laptops come with Paint already installed, right click on the photo, down to 'open with' and select Paint.
If you can find Paint on your laptop, I can tell you how to resize a photo to make it smaller - that is, fewer MB.

The file is already under 3mb though, it’s about 2.5mb...

Also, I’m feeding Tetra Micro Crisps (complete good for small tropical fish)
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Sue on May 13, 2019, 04:05:41 PM
I think the size requirements must be stated incorrectly. I just failed to attach a 2.29 MB photo.

I'll PM the site owner and ask.
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Sue on May 13, 2019, 04:43:56 PM
I've just had a reply from Robert and he can't get it to work either. He doesn't know why the server won't allow photos just under the limit but says that 2000 KB or lower should work OK, so photos resized to that should attach OK.
He also gave a link to a site that can be used for resizing http://www.picresize.com/
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on May 13, 2019, 05:28:26 PM
I've just had a reply from Robert and he can't get it to work either. He doesn't know why the server won't allow photos just under the limit but says that 2000 KB or lower should work OK, so photos resized to that should attach OK.
He also gave a link to a site that can be used for resizing http://www.picresize.com/

Alright, awesome! I’ll give that a go later then and try and upload a now and before photo
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Matt on May 15, 2019, 10:31:17 AM
Also worth checking the file type is one of those listed if your still struggling... I know I had a problem once with a file named *.jpeg rather than *.jpg
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on May 16, 2019, 11:33:29 PM
Also worth checking the file type is one of those listed if your still struggling... I know I had a problem once with a file named *.jpeg rather than *.jpg

I’ll try that as soon as I can!
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on May 17, 2019, 07:31:07 AM
Also worth checking the file type is one of those listed if your still struggling... I know I had a problem once with a file named *.jpeg rather than *.jpg

Ah ok! I’ll give that a try too then
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on May 19, 2019, 11:04:32 AM
So I have the LoveFish Panorama 64litre tank from p@h and it comes with a built in feature of a light connected to the filter which flashes every 28 days to remind you to change the filter insides. I had a look on the YouTube tutorial for this but it makes no sense to me?? Surely you should be leaving it alone and not changing it constantly as that’s where the good bacteria is??
Should I be changing it or leave it and ignore that part? I can link the video if it’s allowed (not sure if it is, let me know)
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Matt on May 19, 2019, 12:00:47 PM
You should absolutely leave it alone. I've disconnected my reminder light...

Be warned though that the tank doesnt actually come with proper biological media. Only the algaway pad (which compacts quickly so flow doesn't pass through efficiently) and the carbon media. I replaced everything quite quickly to a block of plain filter sponge once I learnt about proper filtration and would recommend you do the same before too far set up.

Otherwise it is actually a very good set up!
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on May 19, 2019, 12:09:40 PM
You should absolutely leave it alone. I've disconnected my reminder light...

Be warned though that the tank doesnt actually come with proper biological media. Only the algaway pad (which compacts quickly so flow doesn't pass through efficiently) and the carbon media. I replaced everything quite quickly to a block of plain filter sponge once I learnt about proper filtration and would recommend you do the same before too far set up.

Otherwise it is actually a very good set up!

Thank you! I noticed it came on last night but left it as I got in quite late after some wine aha and checked on it this morning but didn’t want to do anything until I had a check with you guys
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Matt on May 19, 2019, 12:13:58 PM
It's like printer cartridges, they are just trying to sell you more stuff!

Look up the interpret cf2 filter to see the missing cartridge. The love fish brand is knockoff versions of their stuff.
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on May 19, 2019, 06:44:36 PM
So I now have 6 otos. I floated them, then put some of the tank’s water in with them, about a quarter of a cup each time with about 5-10 minutes in between. Then they were left for a bit then I used a net to get them in (I ended up pouring the water away into my sink with the net at the mouth to catch them before quickly running back to the tank). The lights were off the entire time and four seem to be happily munching on some algae while two just sat there. I also did a 25% water change as it was due. I’d done a water sample at the shop before getting the fish and was told everything is fine apart from I think my nitrate (?) levels were a bit high - hence the big water change. I also got given some catfish pellets but I’m not sure if I should feed them to my otos. I’m gonna get some pebbles and grow some algae on them for when there’s no algae in the tank.
My wood is now sinking so I’m just gonna wait until the otos clear the algae up to put them in and I got a stack of three tubes with some green felt ornament so will put that in at the same time.
Also, once I get some more money (I spent it all today on fish 😂) I’ll be getting some more plants with some water sprite being on the top of the list as my chosen floating plant given it doesn’t mind condensation, doesn’t drop needles like some floating plants and doesn’t get too out of control like duckweed apparently does.
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Sue on May 19, 2019, 07:10:45 PM
Since you have fish, don't swap all the media at once. You do need to change the algaway pad and carbon as Matt said, just not all together. Swap one of them for a piece of sponge, then monitor ammonia and nitrite every day - and do a water change whenever you see either above zero. Any mini cycle will not last long. 6 weeks later, swap the other one, and again monitor ammonia and nitrite daily until they stay at zero by themselves.


Water sprite can grow quite big, then the old fronds start to turn brown. Just remove the old bits but check them for new plantlets growing on the old leaves before throwing them away (mine go into the compost bin)
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on May 19, 2019, 07:18:45 PM
Since you have fish, don't swap all the media at once. You do need to change the algaway pad and carbon as Matt said, just not all together. Swap one of them for a piece of sponge, then monitor ammonia and nitrite every day - and do a water change whenever you see either above zero. Any mini cycle will not last long. 6 weeks later, swap the other one, and again monitor ammonia and nitrite daily until they stay at zero by themselves.


Water sprite can grow quite big, then the old fronds start to turn brown. Just remove the old bits but check them for new plantlets growing on the old leaves before throwing them away (mine go into the compost bin)

Do I swap both for bits of sponge? And if I leave them for two weeks, will that ruin the tank? I get money then so would be helpful aha
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Sue on May 19, 2019, 07:31:20 PM
Yes, you want just sponge inside the filter. Waiting won't ruin the tank, but do the first one as soon as you can. It doesn't really matter which one you swap first as long as you leave at least 6 weeks between.

Carbon adsorbs things, which means they stick to its surface rather than penetrating inside (that's absorbing). Once the carbon gets full it stop adsorbing things. This is why they tell you to change it. Yes, bacteria will also grow on the carbon - and particularly on the 'bag' part of a cartridge. Assuming the carbon is in a cartridge, when you change that one, cut a hole in the bag and throw away the carbon. Then cut the fabric off any plastic frame and put the fabric back into the filter anywhere it can touch the new sponge.

I can't find out exactly what the algaway pad does - Matt might know - but it probably absorbs something that encourages algae to grow and is aimed at people who do the minimum tank maintenance. The pad probably also gets full and stops working, which is why they tell you to change it. The pad will also grow bacteria on it, but in this case there isn't any of it you can leave in the filter.



I forgot to mention that you should not get any more fish until at least 6 weeks after you change the second one.
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on May 19, 2019, 08:03:37 PM
Yes, you want just sponge inside the filter. Waiting won't ruin the tank, but do the first one as soon as you can. It doesn't really matter which one you swap first as long as you leave at least 6 weeks between.

Carbon adsorbs things, which means they stick to its surface rather than penetrating inside (that's absorbing). Once the carbon gets full it stop adsorbing things. This is why they tell you to change it. Yes, bacteria will also grow on the carbon - and particularly on the 'bag' part of a cartridge. Assuming the carbon is in a cartridge, when you change that one, cut a hole in the bag and throw away the carbon. Then cut the fabric off any plastic frame and put the fabric back into the filter anywhere it can touch the new sponge.

I can't find out exactly what the algaway pad does - Matt might know - but it probably absorbs something that encourages algae to grow and is aimed at people who do the minimum tank maintenance. The pad probably also gets full and stops working, which is why they tell you to change it. The pad will also grow bacteria on it, but in this case there isn't any of it you can leave in the filter.



I forgot to mention that you should not get any more fish until at least 6 weeks after you change the second one.

So keep the carbon fabric and throw everything else, got it.
So once I change the first filter part I need to wait at least 12 weeks if I change the second part on time before getting more fish yes?
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Sue on May 19, 2019, 08:24:13 PM
That's right.

The bacteria we want to grow multiply slowly. Under their ideal conditions they can double their numbers in 24 to 36 hours. But waiting 6 weeks ensures that a lot have migrated into the new media before you remove the next bit of old media.

The bacteria are fairly static. They don't just get up and wander into new media. But when you remove old media you take a lot of bacteria away with the old media so they have to make more, and a lot of the new bacteria will end up in the new media. It is then a case of waiting till they've properly bedded into the biofilm that grows all over the new media before stressing them by removing another bit of bacteria containing old media.

Getting more fish adds more ammonia to the tank, so it's best not to do that until there are enough new bacteria to deal with the ammonia from the current fish.


Getting new plants will also help as they will remove a lot of ammonia, and they don't turn it into nitrite like the bacteria do.
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on May 19, 2019, 08:52:48 PM
That's right.

The bacteria we want to grow multiply slowly. Under their ideal conditions they can double their numbers in 24 to 36 hours. But waiting 6 weeks ensures that a lot have migrated into the new media before you remove the next bit of old media.

The bacteria are fairly static. They don't just get up and wander into new media. But when you remove old media you take a lot of bacteria away with the old media so they have to make more, and a lot of the new bacteria will end up in the new media. It is then a case of waiting till they've properly bedded into the biofilm that grows all over the new media before stressing them by removing another bit of bacteria containing old media.

Getting more fish adds more ammonia to the tank, so it's best not to do that until there are enough new bacteria to deal with the ammonia from the current fish.


Getting new plants will also help as they will remove a lot of ammonia, and they don't turn it into nitrite like the bacteria do.

I’m planning on getting a bulk lot of plants from eBay, wondering if that’s a good idea or if individual plants would be better?
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Matt on May 19, 2019, 10:15:00 PM
Nothing wrong with getting plants in bulk  :cheers:

By the way 25% is not a big water change... I do 50% every week, as do most others on here I believe. I would do another 50% water change tomorrow if your nitrates were high...
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on May 19, 2019, 10:34:09 PM
Nothing wrong with getting plants in bulk  :cheers:

By the way 25% is not a big water change... I do 50% every week, as do most others on here I believe. I would do another 50% water change tomorrow if your nitrates were high...

Oh wow. I thought that 10% was a standard weekly water change level!
I’ll do another 50% either tomorrow or Tuesday (I’ve got a job interview tomorrow and no idea how long it’s gonna take so)
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Sue on May 20, 2019, 12:17:51 PM
It used to be 10% a week, then 25% a week, now 50% or more a week is recommended. Some people still go by 10% a week, though; people you speak to and on-line. These people have not kept up to date  :)

Also daily water changes of at least 75% is recommended if the fish start to look or behave oddly. 95% of fish illness is due to poor water quality, and several large water changes can 'cure' the fish without resorting to medication.
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on May 24, 2019, 04:25:22 PM
Is it odd that my fish will suddenly move/start swimming faster when I open my bedroom door? I only noticed it just now. My door has a metal decor on it so makes a noise so wondering if they don’t like the noise or do they recognise that I’m coming into the room?

Also, I’ve noticed that my 6 Harlequins look slightly washed out. Normally they have a good bit of colour to them and did this morning (their colour varies but they mostly have at least a tinge) but at the moment they only have the very slightest of colour to them. The black triangle is fine, it’s the orange colouring they seem to be lacking...
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Sue on May 24, 2019, 04:30:48 PM
They probably see movement and think it is something large coming to eat them. Mine do the same when I walk into the room. Also my main tank is in the dining room, and they all rush and hide when we stand up and move round at the end of the meal. I find the Espe's rasboras do it most, more than the rice fish.

In the kitchen tank, the betta rushes forwards whenever he sees me. This is typical of bettas though, they just expect to be fed whenever they see a human  ;D
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on May 24, 2019, 08:18:18 PM
They probably see movement and think it is something large coming to eat them. Mine do the same when I walk into the room. Also my main tank is in the dining room, and they all rush and hide when we stand up and move round at the end of the meal. I find the Espe's rasboras do it most, more than the rice fish.

In the kitchen tank, the betta rushes forwards whenever he sees me. This is typical of bettas though, they just expect to be fed whenever they see a human  ;D

Ahh ok cool!
My mum’s looking after them over the weekend while I’m with my dad. She’s got her light and food instructions and has managed to do ok the last few times (apart from putting on the blue light instead of the white light xD)
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Sue on May 24, 2019, 08:26:24 PM
It's a bit short notice this time, but one tip for when getting someone else to feed them - get one of those pill dispensers with a compartment for each day, then measure a day's worth of food into the relevant sections. Or a series of small tubs labelled with each day.

If your mother is well trained, that's fine but don't trust anyone else. A lot of people who don't keep fish think we are mean with the amount of food we tell them and add more. Sometimes a lot more. It is not unknown to return form a holiday to find a lot of dead fish in a tank with large amounts of uneaten food. And if you don't trust the person, hide the food tubs so they can't feed more than you've measured out. We have to be sneaky sometimes  ;D
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on May 24, 2019, 09:34:48 PM
It's a bit short notice this time, but one tip for when getting someone else to feed them - get one of those pill dispensers with a compartment for each day, then measure a day's worth of food into the relevant sections. Or a series of small tubs labelled with each day.

If your mother is well trained, that's fine but don't trust anyone else. A lot of people who don't keep fish think we are mean with the amount of food we tell them and add more. Sometimes a lot more. It is not unknown to return form a holiday to find a lot of dead fish in a tank with large amounts of uneaten food. And if you don't trust the person, hide the food tubs so they can't feed more than you've measured out. We have to be sneaky sometimes  ;D

I trust my mum. I told her how much to feed and told her not to feed more, calling them greedy _______s 😂

I had to write it on a bit of paper that goes on my door so she doesn’t forget :)
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on June 03, 2019, 10:36:27 AM
https://www.petsathome.com/shop/en/pets/carbon-filter-sponge-x-2

Is this sort of thing the right thing to put into the filter in exchange for the stuff that’s already in there?

I also got some daphnia for my harlequins so they’ll have them once I get home from school :)
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on June 03, 2019, 12:43:11 PM
Pic 1: Before fish were added
Pic 2: Before the otos were added
Pic 3: Yesterday
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Matt on June 03, 2019, 06:36:07 PM
https://www.petsathome.com/shop/en/pets/carbon-filter-sponge-x-2

Is this sort of thing the right thing to put into the filter in exchange for the stuff that’s already in there?

I also got some daphnia for my harlequins so they’ll have them once I get home from school :)

You want a 'normal' non carbon sponge like this...
https://www.petsathome.com/shop/en/pets/fine-filter-sponge (https://www.petsathome.com/shop/en/pets/fine-filter-sponge)
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on June 03, 2019, 07:03:02 PM
https://www.petsathome.com/shop/en/pets/carbon-filter-sponge-x-2

Is this sort of thing the right thing to put into the filter in exchange for the stuff that’s already in there?

I also got some daphnia for my harlequins so they’ll have them once I get home from school :)

You want a 'normal' non carbon sponge like this...
https://www.petsathome.com/shop/en/pets/fine-filter-sponge (https://www.petsathome.com/shop/en/pets/fine-filter-sponge)

Ahh thank you!

I was looking at plants for sale on eBay but it’s baffling me slightly... what key basic things should I be looking for?
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Matt on June 04, 2019, 03:10:31 PM
Hmm good question...
I would want some reassurance they will be well packaged and delivered relatively quickly.
You may wish to look for shrimp safe depending on future stocking plans.
Pest/snail free is something else to look out for (though this likely wont be fool proof anyway!) though you can also treat them yourself once they arrive.
Some sellers may state whether they have been grown emersed or emerged. Emersed is more robust for transport, emerged less robust but will adjust quicker once arrives (can be personal choice here but I personally prefer emersed).

Another good way to go is post a 'wanted' post for your plants on a planted tank forum. The people there will have offcuts they may be willing to give away for free... this way you know they've been looked after too.

That's what I can think of off the top of my head... I'll have a think later on too..

Oh an in vitro... you get a lot of very small plants with no risk of pests, disease etc etc. but they are more expensive.

Any particular reason you are ordering online?

Must dash!
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on June 04, 2019, 04:18:46 PM
Ordering online mostly because the fish shops near me aren’t great for plant stock. I got two from p@h when I got my tank and they’ve done really well but have been into several and they don’t have a great stock. I was told buying online is often a good way to go by Sue so had a look but got slightly confused aha.
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Sue on June 04, 2019, 05:16:00 PM
I don't buy plants unless I've researched them first, then I go to Ebay and look for that particular plant. Because I have shrimps and nerite snails, I always look for the ones guaranteed shrimp safe. I don't mind if the plants have pest snails because I have them anyway.
My plants are all the kind that can be attached to decor, or used as floating plants so there are not many for me to choose from  ;D



When the EU banned the import of apple snails, they were also going to ban the import of plants from areas where apple snails abound. They did see some sense, and changed the legislation to banning of the import of plants unless they had been treated with a snail killer. These chemicals also kill shrimps. Plants grown in the EU are exempt from treatment as apple snails are not endemic to the EU.
The trouble is that we can't know which plants on Ebay (or other sites) were imported into the EU and which were grown inside the EU, so looking for a shrimp safe plant is all we can do to avoid killing our shrimps.

After brexit, the UK will need to repeal any laws passed while we were EU members for them not to apply to us any longer, and I can't see any tropical fish related laws being repealed for decades, if ever. So we'll still need to look for shrimp safe plants if we have have any invertebrates in our tanks.
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on June 04, 2019, 06:10:10 PM
I’m guessing that even though I don’t have shrimp or snails it’s sensible to check for that anyways?
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Littlefish on June 08, 2019, 08:23:06 AM
There are lots of reputable on-line sellers, though sometimes you have to pay a bit more for plants that are guaranteed "safe" (e.g. Tropica 1-2-Grow range).
There are other options for treating plants before introducing them to your tank, and if you have a look on https://www.ukaps.org/ you'll find various suggestions for dipping plants in things like potassium permanganate or sodium hypochlorite (bleach) solutions to deal with pest snails/eggs/etc.
Whatever you do with the plants, make sure that they are thoroughly rinsed prior to putting them into your tank. As far as I'm concerned, there's nothing wrong with having them "quarantined" in a suitably sized container (sandwich box/jug/spare tank/anything) for a few days/weeks, as long as they have suitable light and nutrients, and it might be worth doing that if you are dipping/treating them. You'd be amazed at what I've put plants in when stripping down a tank for re-work.  ;D
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on June 20, 2019, 11:12:22 PM
So a little update:

My water sprite is happily growing, I washed it well and cleaned the foam type thing off which ended up with it separating into 3 sections so they’re floating around.
I added some plant fertiliser in that I have yesterday so hopefully the plants stay healthy.
All the harlequin Rasboras are doing well and seem to be happy.
I changed one section of the filter for some normal sponge like you guys suggested on Sunday I think it was so just waiting for that to settle to do the next section.
Unfortunately I lost one of the otos on Sunday, found him dead on the bottom of the tank :( I don’t see much of them these days but I heard they’re vaguely nocturnal and rather shy so it would make sense as to why I only see 1 or 2 max during the day but have seen 4 recently in the morning just before turning the light on.
The algae is pretty much all gone so I’m gonna start blanching some spinach I think for the otos as they haven’t taken any interest in the catfish pellets I got given to try them on.
I think that’s about it so yeah, just thought you’d like an update :)
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Matt on June 21, 2019, 04:57:22 AM
Don't feel too down about the oto, they are tricky to get settled, and poor treatment from capture to store can play a big part. they actually have a bacteria in their bellies which help them to digest their food. if they have gone too long without food, no matter how much they eat their bodies cannot process it. this may well have been the case here. try feeding them algae waters rather than catfish pellets which they should eat a bit more readily. catfish pellets are a bit protein rich for the otos.

the water sprite can be planted in the bottom to stop them floating if you want. what fertiliser did you use?

good job on the filter, sounds like your doing just fine  :cheers:
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on June 21, 2019, 07:31:11 AM
Don't feel too down about the oto, they are tricky to get settled, and poor treatment from capture to store can play a big part. they actually have a bacteria in their bellies which help them to digest their food. if they have gone too long without food, no matter how much they eat their bodies cannot process it. this may well have been the case here. try feeding them algae waters rather than catfish pellets which they should eat a bit more readily. catfish pellets are a bit protein rich for the otos.

the water sprite can be planted in the bottom to stop them floating if you want. what fertiliser did you use?

good job on the filter, sounds like your doing just fine  :cheers:

I actually really like it floating plus the harlequins are enjoying the shade from the lights I think, they hide in it sometimes when I come in the room too so I think they like it.
The fertiliser is plantamin by Tetra. Says it’s got iron, potassium, manganese and some other elements but no phosphate or nitrate
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Sue on June 21, 2019, 09:01:32 AM
One of the best trace element fertilisers (by which I mean it does not contain nitrogen, potassium of phosphorus, the macro nutrients) is Seachem Flourish comprehensive supplement for the planted aquarium. There are several Flourishes, but use only this one. It is missing just one of the micronutrients while other makes are missing more than one.


You can also grow your own algae. You just need a few rocks, a glass container full of water and a sunny window sill. Once algae has grown on the rocks out one in the tank. When it's been cleaned by the otos, put another in the tank and the cleaned one back in the container to grow some more algae.
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Littlefish on June 22, 2019, 06:01:17 PM
I've currently got a small tank on a sunny windowsill to grow algae on rocks for some of my algae eaters. It takes a while to get started, I used a few flakes of fish food and some old tank water for these rocks, but once it gets going you got a constant supply.
It's good to hear an update on your tank. I think that quite a lot of fish enjoy a bit of floating greenery in the tank. As Matt has mentioned, otos can be a bit tricky. Sorry to hear that you lost one, and I hope the rest of your fish continue to do well.  :)
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on June 24, 2019, 06:20:50 AM
So I lost another oto yesterday. I’m wondering if losing them so close means I’m doing something wrong? The harlequins seem quite content and I saw two of the otos just before I went to sleep yesterday but worried slightly. Or is they dying close just because now is when their bacteria start to have their problems?
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Sue on June 24, 2019, 09:04:00 AM
Do the otos have plump bellies or sunken bellies? Plump, but not fat, bellies are a good sign; sunken bellies are not good.
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Littlefish on June 24, 2019, 09:18:11 AM
Sorry to hear that you've lost another oto.
Unfortunately this is not uncommon.

Due to their diet these fish are more likely to survive in a more mature tank (>6months) that is heavily planted. This allows for lots of surfaces for biofilm & algae to grow. In a newer tank offering algae wafers doesn't always work, and sometimes it can take fish a while to even get used to algae wafers, and recognise them as food.

On top of that, as Matt has mentioned, they are wild caught, and undergo very stressful conditions during transport. A lot of the fish perish during transport, or very soon after arriving at the shop. Even those that survive may have damage that causes them to perish over the next few weeks. So many problems can occur before purchasing these fish that it is sometimes very difficult to tell if a fish that has survived in the shop is going to survive & thrive in a home tank. Sorry, I know it's not very comforting.

You've got your floating plants, which they will appreciate. Do you have a lamp that you could put close to the tank to encourage algae in an area? I know Sue has mentioned growing algae on rocks in a container on a windowsill, but this will take a while. A lamp or torch pointing at part of the tank will help to grow diatoms & algae on the glass more quickly. If at all possible, make sure the light is near some wood in the tank as well, as the otos will like munching on the biofilm. On top of that make sure that keep testing your water, and doing tank maintenance & water changes to make sure that the environment is as clean as possible (but don't wipe off any diatoms or algae).

Even with all of this, there is a possibility that you may face further losses. Your harlequins are generally considered to be more hardy than otos, and are probably all thoroughly enjoying themselves. Just do your best for your otos, and we'll try to help you with any issues. 
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on June 24, 2019, 11:06:56 AM
I’ll check later as I’m at school right now. I’ve asked my mum to grab me some algae wafers today and I’ll see if I can start growing some algae of my own on rocks. I try to keep the tank light on as long as I can now to get some algae growing and there is some on the leaves of the plants but it’s more towards the surface so I don’t think they go up there much.
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Sue on June 24, 2019, 11:12:40 AM
Otos don't eat every kind of algae, but they do eat some types. It may take them a while to realise that algae wafers are food. Something else I've seen recommended for otos is sushi nori, but apparently it makes quite a mess if left in too long  :sick:
Title: Re: New to fish keeping, would like some help :)
Post by: Alostangel on June 24, 2019, 05:33:01 PM
Oh not fun then! I saw that blanched spinach is a good idea so I might try that? I can only see one oto right now so I’ve got a picture of him/her but not sure where the others are. They seem to be quite shy though
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Matt on June 24, 2019, 09:28:11 PM
Hard to tell from photo  (always hard to get good snaps of fish!), but he/she looks ok to me  :cheers:
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on June 24, 2019, 10:05:51 PM
Hard to tell from photo  (always hard to get good snaps of fish!), but he/she looks ok to me  :cheers:

From what I could tell he/she was fine. Not pale at all or anything like that. They have occasional bursts of energy still but like I said, I don’t see much of them now
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: jaypeecee on June 25, 2019, 09:18:47 AM
Hi Alostangel,

I'm not sure if the following article has been mentioned elsewhere in your thread but it is worth reading:

https://www.practicalfishkeeping.co.uk/features/keeping-otocinclus-catfish-in-the-aquarium/

JPC
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on June 25, 2019, 09:41:03 PM
Hi Alostangel,

I'm not sure if the following article has been mentioned elsewhere in your thread but it is worth reading:

https://www.practicalfishkeeping.co.uk/features/keeping-otocinclus-catfish-in-the-aquarium/

JPC

Oh that’s a good article! I’ve had a read, I’ll have to try and identify the species of mine at some point.

I’ve blanched some spinach and put it in but they haven’t touched it yet. I’m hoping they will overnight.
In other news, I’ve actually applied to Pets At Home to work there. Hopefully I can help people do the right thing (from what I know, I’m aware I’m no expert) by their fish and hamsters, etc. If I do get a job there 😬
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on June 25, 2019, 09:44:40 PM
Ummm so I just looked at my tank... and it looks like there’s a baby fish in there?? I got a video of it but I’m guessing it’ll be too small to get a picture of. I thought I read that ottos and Harlequins are hard to breed??
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Sue on June 25, 2019, 09:57:18 PM
There's a thread on another forum by someone who has just found a baby oto. Apparently they do breed readily in aquariums. One recommendation on there is to add leaves - it's not the right time of year to collect your own and you need to know what kind, but you can buy Indian almond leaves at some fish shops, and on-line. These are very good for fry as they grow micro-organisms which tiny fry can eat. They will float at first but they sink after a few days. Fry can also hide under them (once they've sunk).

Most newly hatched fry look similar, you'll have to wait till it's bigger to identify what it is.
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on June 25, 2019, 10:02:26 PM
There's a thread on another forum by someone who has just found a baby oto. Apparently they do breed readily in aquariums. One recommendation on there is to add leaves - it's not the right time of year to collect your own and you need to know what kind, but you can buy Indian almond leaves at some fish shops, and on-line. These are very good for fry as they grow micro-organisms which tiny fry can eat. They will float at first but they sink after a few days. Fry can also hide under them (once they've sunk).

Most newly hatched fry look similar, you'll have to wait till it's bigger to identify what it is.

Given it’s longer shape, I would hazard a guess at it being an Otto. I read they were hard to breed aha but I guess this may boost my numbers? Are the others likely to try to eat it? (My friends and I have already decided on the name Fred xD)

I’ll see if I can get some leaves then for it, not sure I’m ready to be a grand fishy parent!
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Littlefish on June 27, 2019, 08:42:21 AM
Congratulations on your fish fry.  :cheers:

Such exciting news, it's always lovely to see some little ones in your tank, and watch them grow.

Also good news that you've applied to Pets@Home for a job. In the past they've had a bit of a poor reputation for fish, but I know that the local store here has really upped their game in the past couple of years. Not only have they refurbished the store, but I have also witnessed them questioning customers over their tank, explaining the requirements for fishless cycling, and refusing to sell fish to a customer who is purchasing a tank.  :)
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Matt on June 27, 2019, 12:36:10 PM
The more I think about it, the more their points system for fish stocking makes so much sense to help guide the uninitiated... well done P@H
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on June 27, 2019, 03:46:26 PM
Yeah, I think their points system is good for smaller fish that won’t grow too much but their angelfish are rather low pointed I would say from what I know of their eventual size.
I was quite surprised that my Harlequins who were from P@H have survived this long I’ll be honest! But the guy who sold them did ask quite a few questions about the tank, and how long it had been set up but nothing about cycling it... hopefully that’ll come in :)
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Matt on June 27, 2019, 04:07:47 PM
Yeah my Harlies from P@H lasted ages too  :D
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on June 29, 2019, 11:37:05 AM
Yeah my Harlies from P@H lasted ages too  :D

That’s good news then! I’ve got to figure out what I’m gonna do with them when I finish sixth form as I’m planning on moving to Newmarket 😬 so gotta figure out a way to move them up there (it’s a 1.5 hour drive)
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: fcmf on June 29, 2019, 12:10:44 PM
I’ve got to figure out what I’m gonna do with them when I finish sixth form as I’m planning on moving to Newmarket 😬 so gotta figure out a way to move them up there (it’s a 1.5 hour drive)
You might find this article helpful: https://www.thinkfish.co.uk/article/moving-your-fishtank-and-tropical-fish

Congrats on the fish fry!  :fishy1:
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Littlefish on June 29, 2019, 12:37:24 PM
And this one https://www.practicalfishkeeping.co.uk/features/travels-with-your-fish/

Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on June 29, 2019, 01:13:10 PM
Thank you! I’ll have to revisit those when it comes to moving them! Glad I mentioned it so it gives me lots of time to prepare for it
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Sue on June 29, 2019, 04:00:07 PM
Once you have an address in Newmarket look at the water company website for details of hardness and pH. If they are similar to your current water, that's OK; but if they are very different, we can help you acclimatise your fish to different water.
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on June 29, 2019, 04:50:26 PM
Sounds good. I’ve got over a year so it’s not urgent
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Littlefish on June 30, 2019, 10:02:01 AM
As far as I remember, It's Anglian Water. The hardness is similar to what I have in Cambridge (17dH), but with lower nitrates (around 25-30ppm, rather than the 40 I have here).
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on July 04, 2019, 09:16:19 PM
So I’m currently having a bit of an issue I guess you could say with my gravel looking rather horrible. It’s dirty and there’s so algae trapped in the spaces underneath it against the glass that the ottos can’t get to. I had a search and most things I saw said to siphon it close to the gravel but I really doubt that’s going to work. If there any other way I can clean the gravel and the glass around it?
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Matt on July 04, 2019, 09:32:30 PM
The algae has grow just on the glass round the bottom of the tank... it's not in the gravel as such. It can give ow here due to light reflected off the internal surface of the glass. I know a simple and very effective solution! Take an old credit card, and, being careful not to trap anything between it and the glass, scrape the algae off the glass by passing the credit card down between the glass and gravel, at a slight angle to scrape it nice and clean!  :cheers:
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on July 04, 2019, 09:36:03 PM
The algae has grow just on the glass round the bottom of the tank... it's not in the gravel as such. It can give ow here due to light reflected off the internal surface of the glass. I know a simple and very effective solution! Take an old credit card, and, being careful not to trap anything between it and the glass, scrape the algae off the glass by passing the credit card down between the glass and gravel, at a slight angle to scrape it nice and clean!  :cheers:

Thank you! I’ll definitely have to do that. I also have a glass sponge cleaner for the algae on there too so I’ll do that at the same time. Any recommendations for the actual dirt and stuff around the gravel?
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Matt on July 04, 2019, 09:50:46 PM
If the gravel itself is dirty it would need to be siphoned out, cleaned and returned I would guess... you could clean with bleach then chlorinate very thoroughly...
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on July 04, 2019, 09:52:29 PM
If the gravel itself is dirty it would need to be siphoned out, cleaned and returned I would guess... you could clean with bleach then chlorinate very thoroughly...
Will just scooping it out work? I can do that fairly easily and that should work if I can do that. Would also give me the opportunity to replant my plants outside of their pots :)
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Matt on July 04, 2019, 10:04:07 PM
It would definitely work, Though it might make quite a bit of mess in the tank unless you gravel vacuum very thoroughly. Any length of garden hose or similar could be used to siphon it out. It will probably be easier this way I'd suggest...
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Sue on July 04, 2019, 10:11:07 PM
Don't bleach all the gravel. It is home to a whole host of beneficial micro-organisms. The first thing to try is washing it in dechlorinated water. That should remove any loose debris.
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Matt on July 04, 2019, 10:17:29 PM
Good advice @Sue , I had meant to say in my last lost don't do it all at once. I'd do it in parts even if just using water to be on the safe side.
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on July 04, 2019, 11:37:18 PM
So will it be like my filter media? Do half then do another half 6 weeks later? Or should I do like a cup full each week kind of thing?
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Matt on July 05, 2019, 06:43:51 AM
Id probably do a third a week over three weeks.
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on July 09, 2019, 07:10:29 AM
So I did about a third last night and oh my lord the difference! The actual gravel was dirty so I used and old toothbrush to try and get some of the dirt off and it has made such a difference. It actually looks white now!
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Littlefish on July 10, 2019, 07:28:19 AM
I'm sure it makes a massive difference, keep up the good work.  :)
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Matt on July 10, 2019, 08:58:58 PM
Sounds good! Send photos...  :cheers:
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on July 10, 2019, 11:05:43 PM
Sounds good! Send photos...  :cheers:

Will do! I only did about a quarter so will most likely do a quarter a week for 4 weeks instead of a third a week over 3 weeks
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on July 11, 2019, 10:24:33 AM
Oh and also it seems that my baby fish isn’t an Otto. Seems to be turning into a harlequin! God knows how he came about!
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Sue on July 11, 2019, 11:33:44 AM
Baby egg layers do look similar till they grow a bit. Harlequins often spawn in aquariums, the egg obviously ended up somewhere the fish couldn't find it to eat it.

A few years ago I had pygmy cories which spawned quite regularly. Adult pygmy cories have stripes which run from head to tail. Newly hatched pygmy cories have stripes that run side to side. Then one day you look in the tank and see they have head to tail stripes. Baby fish can change in appearance literally overnight.
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on July 11, 2019, 12:15:58 PM
Baby egg layers do look similar till they grow a bit. Harlequins often spawn in aquariums, the egg obviously ended up somewhere the fish couldn't find it to eat it.

A few years ago I had pygmy cories which spawned quite regularly. Adult pygmy cories have stripes which run from head to tail. Newly hatched pygmy cories have stripes that run side to side. Then one day you look in the tank and see they have head to tail stripes. Baby fish can change in appearance literally overnight.

Gosh. I read that Harlequins are hard to breed in aquariums, it’s one of the reasons I got them aha. But oh wells, it just means that my numbers of them will go up I guess!
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Sue on July 11, 2019, 12:24:56 PM
According to the most respected fish profile website, harlequins in good condition spawn often. The female lays small batches of eggs which the male then fertilises, then this is repeated until the female had laid all her eggs. They often attach the eggs to the underside of a leaf. Depending on temperature, the eggs hatch in 24 to 48 hours, but the newly hatched fry are not free swimming for about another week.
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on July 11, 2019, 12:32:46 PM
According to the most respected fish profile website, harlequins in good condition spawn often. The female lays small batches of eggs which the male then fertilises, then this is repeated until the female had laid all her eggs. They often attach the eggs to the underside of a leaf. Depending on temperature, the eggs hatch in 24 to 48 hours, but the newly hatched fry are not free swimming for about another week.
Well it’s good to know that they’re in good conditions. Must mean something’s right in the tank aha. The baby is now swimming quite happily around the front of the tank pretty much all the time but he does have a corner where he just stays if he gets spooked or at night.
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Littlefish on July 11, 2019, 12:48:52 PM
Congratulations  :cheers:

If you manage to get any pics of your little one please post it.

It's great to hear that your harlequins are in such good conditions. Well done.  :)
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on July 11, 2019, 03:35:16 PM
I tried to get one earlier but unfortunately he moves too quick and my phone camera isn’t great. I’ll see if I can get a better one later
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: fcmf on July 11, 2019, 03:46:57 PM
Oh and also it seems that my baby fish isn’t an Otto. Seems to be turning into a harlequin! God knows how he came about!
Congrats! I've had my harlequins for 4+ years and no babies at all.
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on July 11, 2019, 11:20:24 PM
I must have gotten lucky! I wasn’t trying to breed them aha so they must have decided it on their own...
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Littlefish on July 12, 2019, 08:20:22 AM
I feel your frustration when trying to get pics of little ones with your phone. I was the same with the little panda cory. Small fish are speedy little things, but so cute.  ;D
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on July 12, 2019, 10:52:27 AM
So I tried again and got a better picture of the fish fry and I’m also putting in a picture of the clean vs dirty gravel aha
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Sue on July 12, 2019, 11:22:12 AM
Cute little fish  :) And definitely a harlequin. It always amazes me just how fast a baby fish can change colour/pattern from something that could be any species to something that looks like a miniature adult.


That's one downside of white substrate - it is very hard to keep it looking clean. I've always had 'natural' gravel and then sand - natural being beige brown specked gravel and sand coloured sand. Those don't show any algae etc.
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on July 12, 2019, 03:33:31 PM
Yeah, I was surprised at how quick he’s grown! And I think at some point I’ll change the gravel to sand or something smaller at some point just because I don’t think the white is great and also, I think it’s a bit big for the ottos to be 100% happy with it
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Sue on July 12, 2019, 07:02:24 PM
There is another downside to a white substrate - fish don't like it. There are no freshwater fish that have evolved over a white substrate, most have evolved over dark.

If you want to change to sand, the cheapest is play sand. Both Argos and B&Q sell it. It is highly refined, smooth and no nasty things in it. It has to be smooth or rough sand would abrade children's skin, and any contamination would poison children who regularly eat it either by accident or deliberately. However, it does need a lot of washing to get rid of the dust. Wash as much as you need before staring the swap.
The easiest way is to put the fish and decor in a bucket with as much tank water as will fit. Cover the bucket as fish jump. You can leave the heater and filter in the tank, just turn them off. Then empty the gravel and the rest of the water which will get pretty mucky when you disturb the gravel. Put the sand in the tank, add some dechlorinated water at the right temperature, then replace the decor and fish, adding the old water at the same time, and top up with new water. Keep the lights off the rest of the day as the fish will be stressed by all this.

Sand needs cleaning differently from gravel. The debris sits on top and rather than push the siphon tube into it, you hover the end about a cm above the sand and make little swirling motions to lift the debris off the sand to where it can be sucked up. You will suck up sand, especially at first. If you use a bucket, just rinse the debris out of the bucket and put the sand back in the tank.
When refilling the tank be careful the water doesn't cause a crater in the sand. Some people put a saucer/plate  on the sand and pour the water onto that; I use a 'colander' and pour the water through that as lots of tiny streams of water do less damage than one big stream. My 'colander' is a 150 ml Total yoghurt pot with the entire bottom filled with holes made with a knitting needle  :)
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Littlefish on July 12, 2019, 09:27:39 PM
Your little harlequin is so cute.  ;D

The clean gravel looks much better, keep up the good work.

I tend to use sand in my tanks, especially as I have a mix of corys, plecs, gobies, and loaches in most of the tanks, and sand works well for them.
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Matt on July 13, 2019, 01:42:55 AM
If you don't fancy all the sand washing... B&Q sell a kiln dried sand which barely needs rinsing at all :)
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on July 13, 2019, 09:48:10 AM
There is another downside to a white substrate - fish don't like it. There are no freshwater fish that have evolved over a white substrate, most have evolved over dark.

If you want to change to sand, the cheapest is play sand. Both Argos and B&Q sell it. It is highly refined, smooth and no nasty things in it. It has to be smooth or rough sand would abrade children's skin, and any contamination would poison children who regularly eat it either by accident or deliberately. However, it does need a lot of washing to get rid of the dust. Wash as much as you need before staring the swap.
The easiest way is to put the fish and decor in a bucket with as much tank water as will fit. Cover the bucket as fish jump. You can leave the heater and filter in the tank, just turn them off. Then empty the gravel and the rest of the water which will get pretty mucky when you disturb the gravel. Put the sand in the tank, add some dechlorinated water at the right temperature, then replace the decor and fish, adding the old water at the same time, and top up with new water. Keep the lights off the rest of the day as the fish will be stressed by all this.

Sand needs cleaning differently from gravel. The debris sits on top and rather than push the siphon tube into it, you hover the end about a cm above the sand and make little swirling motions to lift the debris off the sand to where it can be sucked up. You will suck up sand, especially at first. If you use a bucket, just rinse the debris out of the bucket and put the sand back in the tank.
When refilling the tank be careful the water doesn't cause a crater in the sand. Some people put a saucer/plate  on the sand and pour the water onto that; I use a 'colander' and pour the water through that as lots of tiny streams of water do less damage than one big stream. My 'colander' is a 150 ml Total yoghurt pot with the entire bottom filled with holes made with a knitting needle  :)

I’ll definitely bear this in mind if I do go for sand! It won’t be for a while most likely, I’d like to get everything sorted with the filter first I think and wait until the fry has grown up a bit more before I change anything drastic like that
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on July 17, 2019, 08:45:17 PM
So I went to the fish shop in my area after school today and I went in to get some water and all that but I ended up impulse buying about 5 new plants 😂 whoops. My tank now looks quite dense in one corner where the harlequins like to go when they get spooked which is probably a good thing for them. I’ll try and attach a photo after this post so you can see. I’ve now got 7 plants in the gravel and the floating water sprite which has separated into 4 parts.
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on July 17, 2019, 08:52:06 PM
Here’s the updated picture of the tank now! Bonus points if you can spot the baby in there somewhere aha
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Littlefish on July 22, 2019, 08:28:52 AM
Your tanks looks great.  8)

Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on July 23, 2019, 08:53:49 AM
Last night I looked in my tank and it looks like someone’s been eating one of the new plants! Rather frustrating, is there anything I can do to stop it?
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Littlefish on July 24, 2019, 08:14:18 AM
Some fish will nibble on plants. I tend to treat it as just one of those things as everything in the tank is there for the benefit of the fish.
It's probably why aquascapers mainly use shrimp and tiny fish. 
Some plants have tougher leaves, and won't be so prone to nibbling, but that would require some replanting.
Is it a lot of nibbling? Do you know which fish are doing it?
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on July 24, 2019, 10:50:24 AM
I don’t know who’s doing it, I haven’t seen it but there are little holes in the leaves appearing. I’ll try and get a picture of it, it’s only one plant I’ve noticed so far too
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on July 24, 2019, 11:30:37 AM
Also, a little update on the baby Harlequin for you guys! He’s grown a bit and has really started to look more like a Harlequin
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Sue on July 24, 2019, 11:36:03 AM
They grow up so fast  :)



I'm leaving your holey plants to the plant experts......
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: fcmf on July 24, 2019, 11:53:08 AM
Also, a little update on the baby Harlequin for you guys! He’s grown a bit and has really started to look more like a Harlequin
Adorable!  :cheers:
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Littlefish on July 24, 2019, 01:52:36 PM
Your little harlequin is very cute.  :)
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Matt on July 25, 2019, 09:11:49 PM
A photo of the plant would help if possible... are you sure that is it being eaten? Are the holes along the edge of the leaf or in the middle? Do you know what type of plant it is? What livestock do you have? Any shrimp or snails?
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on July 26, 2019, 04:34:54 AM
I should be able to get a photo today. I can’t remember the name of the plant but it’s red so there can’t be many to choose from. The holes are mostly on the edge I think. I have no snails or shrimp, but 4 ottos and now 7 Harlequin Rasboras. Hope that kinda helps
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on July 29, 2019, 02:44:51 PM
Well the snails I found yesterday in my tank might explain the problem! Very annoying as I think there’s already quite a few in there plus I had washed the new plants I put in there before I put them in as I needed to get rid of the stuff in the pots with them. Grrrr. But I also spotted another 2 baby harlequins! Which would put my numbers up to 9 of them!
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: fcmf on July 29, 2019, 07:46:08 PM
When I kept live plants, I resorted to giving them an aquarium salt dip for ~20mins, then thoroughly rinsing them over and over again, before putting them in the tank - this must have worked because I only seemed to acquire snails when I didn't do this.

Congrats once again - very envious of you and your baby harlequins. Mine are 4.25 (almost) years old and they've never produced any babies in all that time.




Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Sue on July 29, 2019, 09:08:11 PM
Snails don't usually eat live healthy plants. They do eat dead and dying plants and they also eat the biofilm on the surface of the leaves.It is possible that the plant is not very healthy and the snails are making the most of that. Red plants are more difficult to grow than green plants.
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on July 30, 2019, 07:11:49 AM
I’ll admit the red one isn’t going as good. But it seemed to be a green one as well which has been in there a while and doing very well. I’ll probably have to take the red one out and put something else in as it’s not doing well. I’ll try and attach some pictures
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on July 30, 2019, 07:14:58 AM
Also, I’ve been removing snails when I see them but it’s not that often as I’m currently not living at home so my mum and sister are taking care of them. I’ve asked my sister to continue taking them out but I feel I will just get an Assassin Snail once I get home from holiday

I think the two plants I found holes in are Hygrophila ‘Siamensis’ (the green one) and the red one is Alternanthera reineckii ‘Pink’
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Matt on July 31, 2019, 06:40:13 AM
I honestly didn't expect to see what does indeed look like your plants are being eaten... I'm stumped... they are both quite soft leaves species too which makes sense that it would be these being eaten over any others.

What are you feeding your fish, how much and how often?

How long ago did you add the plants?

Are you dosing the plantamin at the recommended level and frequency?

I believe Alternanthera is tasty to Amano shrimp but I know you don't have any of these...

 ???
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: fcmf on July 31, 2019, 12:41:47 PM
That photo looks identical to my plants (when I kept live plants) when I simultaneously discovered that snails had hitch-hiked in on them. Basically, I bought a few new plants, then, within days, this would happen and I'd discover some snails (and more over time). Once I reverted to the thorough rinsing, 20-minute salt dips and thorough rinsing for the plants before putting them in the tank, that particular problem stopped.
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on July 31, 2019, 11:29:32 PM
I honestly didn't expect to see what does indeed look like your plants are being eaten... I'm stumped... they are both quite soft leaves species too which makes sense that it would be these being eaten over any others.

What are you feeding your fish, how much and how often?

How long ago did you add the plants?

Are you dosing the plantamin at the recommended level and frequency?

I believe Alternanthera is tasty to Amano shrimp but I know you don't have any of these...

 ???

It was worse when I checked today too but I didn’t get pictures.

I feed once a day, I add in small doses until they stop coming to the surface so readily so they shouldn’t be hungry and very few flakes are wasted and if they are then the fish tend to clean them up though the day. I also add an algae wafer every two to three days.

I added them 2 weeks ago (the 17th Of July)

I’ve been adding the plantamin at the correct dosage (which works out as about 15ml (5ml per 20 litres x 3)) and have been doing it every month on the same date (I have a reminder in my calendar) for a few months now.
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on July 31, 2019, 11:31:38 PM
That photo looks identical to my plants (when I kept live plants) when I simultaneously discovered that snails had hitch-hiked in on them. Basically, I bought a few new plants, then, within days, this would happen and I'd discover some snails (and more over time). Once I reverted to the thorough rinsing, 20-minute salt dips and thorough rinsing for the plants before putting them in the tank, that particular problem stopped.

I’ll have to buy that when I buy a replacement plant (my red plant seems really unhappy, it has clear leaves and it’s just obviously not a fan). I think I’ll get an Assassin Snail to deal with my current snail problem and then either keep it to clear up some debris or give it to my sister who is planning a cold water tank for a blackmoor currently.
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Matt on August 01, 2019, 08:35:39 AM
Whilst I don't doubt the initial problem is snails, see through leaves and the recency at which you added your plants suggests they are adjusting to underwater growth. The plants we buy have been grown out of water by the nurseries (faster and cheaper to grow) we then dump them in our tanks and crypts are one species which very obviously "melts" off it's leaves and replaces them with ones readily adapted for underwater growth. Your red plant may be doing the same. Are there any signs of fresh growth on the plant? If so, don't give up on it yet, just cut off any unhealthy leaves.

Are you just doing the plantamin monthly or topping it up at each water change as well?
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on August 01, 2019, 11:28:13 AM
Whilst I don't doubt the initial problem is snails, see through leaves and the recency at which you added your plants suggests they are adjusting to underwater growth. The plants we buy have been grown out of water by the nurseries (faster and cheaper to grow) we then dump them in our tanks and crypts are one species which very obviously "melts" off it's leaves and replaces them with ones readily adapted for underwater growth. Your red plant may be doing the same. Are there any signs of fresh growth on the plant? If so, don't give up on it yet, just cut off any unhealthy leaves.

Are you just doing the plantamin monthly or topping it up at each water change as well?

Ahh ok. I won’t worry too much about the red plant then!

I’ve been doing it monthly and I tend to do a water change before I put it in so that it has time to work a bit before I do another water change
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Littlefish on August 01, 2019, 02:04:28 PM
I like assassin snails. Mine are very good with pest snails, to the point I now breed pest snails in a spare tank for them.
Just to let you know that they are tropical and won't do very well in a cold water tank.
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on August 01, 2019, 04:21:38 PM
Ahh ok! I’ll probably keep it then just to be pretty and maintain the 0 other snails policy :)
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Matt on August 02, 2019, 08:28:52 PM
Ok good that your dosing post water change but are you only doing water changes on a monthly basis? You should look to do around a 50% water change weekly. If your on this schedule you will also need to do a 50% dose each week too of course to maintain the right levels of the fertiliser in the tank.
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on August 02, 2019, 08:34:33 PM
Ok good that your dosing post water change but are you only doing water changes on a monthly basis? You should look to do around a 50% water change weekly. If your on this schedule you will also need to do a 50% dose each week too of course to maintain the right levels of the fertiliser in the tank.

No, I’m doing them more frequently than monthly. It might only be about 50% fortnightly though... I’ll make sure to start adding the fertiliser in with the new water though!
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Sue on August 03, 2019, 11:52:28 AM
I have been told that fertiliser should only be added the day after a water change. Most dechlorinators also contain something to bind metals and if you add dechlorinator and fertiliser at the same time, the dechlorinator removes all the trace metals in the fertiliser.
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Matt on August 03, 2019, 03:01:57 PM
I heard this too though I’ll admit that I’m not organised enough to remember to do it!!
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Sue on August 03, 2019, 03:47:38 PM
It's often 2 or 3 days later by the time I remember.....
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on August 04, 2019, 11:56:14 AM
So I did a water change today and made sure to add the fertiliser. The red plant’s stems look quite healthy so I’m sure it is just a case of it revamping it’s leaves. Fred the first baby is growing up! He’s swimming properly with the shoal now (they tend to bunch together loosely most of the time) while the two newest babies are still only small and are keeping out the way.
I haven’t seen any more snails lately so maybe I got them all? I’ll most likely still get an Assassin Snail though because it would be handy to have a Snail I think for the debris plus to pick up any future snails that appear if at all.
I’m going away for 5 days so my mum’s friend I mentioned a while back is house sitting. I’ve left instructions on my door for him and he’s kept fish before so hopefully they’ll be fine!
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Sue on August 04, 2019, 12:01:49 PM
Just because he's kept fish in the past doesn't mean he won't over feed the fish. Buy one of those pill dispensers with a compartment for each day, and place a day's worth of food into the relevant compartments. Then hide the food tubs. Tell him all he needs to do is empty the compartment for that day into the tank.

To be honest, I would hide everything that can be added to a tank. Better safe than sorry.
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on August 04, 2019, 04:28:28 PM
He’s pretty sensible, I gave him instructions on how I feed which is essentially add tiny amounts until they don’t take them as readily.
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on August 10, 2019, 10:47:20 PM
So I’m back from holiday (it was only a few days but long enough for a good tan!) and all the fish seem fine, just as I left them. My sister now has her tank set up, with some plants and a filter for her blackmoor and she wanted my white gravel so I got some black sand and mixed it with some white sand I also brought and washed it before putting my fish into a bucket (with the heater in it) filled with their water plus all the plants. I then drained the whole tank, having taken everything out. After that, I took the gravel out and my sister now has that in her tank then replaced it with sand (more sand than gravel so the plants have a bit more to hold them in) and I also hooked up my Captain Jack Sparrow compass to the air pump and put my wood and plants back. I got some stones/pebbles too (which I gave a thorough wash) and so I put them in the tank as well before slowly filling it with water (I cleaned the glass of the tank before all this as well as having cleaned the heater, filter outside and thermometer) by filling a jug of water and carefully pouring that onto one of the pieces of wood. Once it was all full, I put my fish back quickly as I could and cleaned my water sprite of all the algae on it (as well as doing some ‘deadheading’ so to speak) and put that back. The lights are off and have been for a while now, I left them off when I put the fish back. One thing I might mention though is that I had a fish (not sure if it was the same one) jump out of the bucket twice however they were quickly rescued and the first time was when I had just put the plants back so I put the floating water sprite over the top and the second time was when I went to move the bucket closer to the tank to put them back. They seem fine though, the first baby fish who’s grown up quite a bit now is also fine and even the two newest babies managed to be ok as they were transported! I’ll attach photos of the tank now to a post so you can see what’s changed :)
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Littlefish on August 11, 2019, 09:41:46 AM
Glad to hear that everything has gone well, and I'm looking forward to seeing pictures of your tank.  :)
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Matt on August 11, 2019, 10:10:32 AM
I know how much effort doing all that takes!! Well done you  :cheers:

Also looking forward to the pictures!!
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on August 11, 2019, 11:11:37 AM
I’ll attach photos as soon as I can but for some reason I keep getting a silly website pop up when I try to go on most places within this website! Saying I’ve won an iPhone Max or something. I’m not silly so I know not to believe it but it’s rather annoying as it means I can’t get onto this page at times
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Matt on August 11, 2019, 11:17:54 AM
FYI @Robert
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on August 11, 2019, 01:04:10 PM
They seem to all be quite active this morning, even the two ottos! I thought I had 4 left as two died of my original 6 but I only saw 2 as I cleaned and redid the tank. I haven’t sucked any away in water changes and to my knowledge only 2 died so not sure what happened to the other two. I’ll have to take a trip to the shop I got them from and push my numbers back up to six... The Harlequins are busy exploring and will separate and come back together frequently so I’m putting that all down to the stress of the moving around. They also haven’t eaten this morning, but I did offer so I’m including that in the stress too.
The compass I have turned off for now though because I think it was stressing them out with one massive bubble every 4-5 seconds so I need to find a way of making it do lots of little bubbles instead if I can.
I’ll put some more plantamin in today (full dosage as I replaced all the water) but everyone seems to be a happy colour and acting pretty much as they should I believe.
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Robert on August 12, 2019, 06:53:47 PM
I’ll attach photos as soon as I can but for some reason I keep getting a silly website pop up when I try to go on most places within this website! Saying I’ve won an iPhone Max or something. I’m not silly so I know not to believe it but it’s rather annoying as it means I can’t get onto this page at times


Some users see Ads more than others but they shouldn't reduce usability. If it happens again, please screenshot and email me :)
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on August 12, 2019, 07:39:31 PM
I’ll attach photos as soon as I can but for some reason I keep getting a silly website pop up when I try to go on most places within this website! Saying I’ve won an iPhone Max or something. I’m not silly so I know not to believe it but it’s rather annoying as it means I can’t get onto this page at times


Some users see Ads more than others but they shouldn't reduce usability. If it happens again, please screenshot and email me :)

It wasn’t a normal ad, it was more like it was always taking me to an unsecure website which was trying to run a scam. Hope that helps a bit
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Sue on August 12, 2019, 08:16:01 PM
Are you using a laptop or iphone/tablet? If it's a laptop, have you tried doing a virus scan?
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on August 12, 2019, 09:46:41 PM
Are you using a laptop or iphone/tablet? If it's a laptop, have you tried doing a virus scan?

I use my iPhone :) I find it’s more convenient here than on my laptop
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on August 19, 2019, 04:01:03 PM
So it’s been 13 weeks since I replaced one part of the filter media (I lost track of time and only just counted so should have changed the other part but oh well) and so I actually ended up getting 6 Cardinal Tetras today while my sister got her blackmoor. They all seem healthy, they have a good colour to them and are a decent size.

I turned the lights in the tank off, floated them for 20-30 minutes to let them acclimatise to temperature and have now been adding water from the tank into the bag every 10-15 minutes about 3 times to get them used to the water chemistry. I’m just about to met them out and put them into the tank so hopefully they’ll be quite happy.

Also, I did have to remove a plant because it had some fuzzy stuff growing on it and wasn’t looking healthy at all. I’ve been trying to remove some snails but I’ll be getting an Assassin Snail on Wednesday to fix that problem hopefully. I’ve put in my calendar to change the other part of the filter in 6 weeks time.
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on August 27, 2019, 01:15:28 PM
So I managed to get a really good picture of one of my most recent baby Harlequins! They’re really starting to look like Harlequins now.

The cardinals have settled in well and are more than happy swimming in all areas of the tank, just like the Harlequins. However I seem to have lost one as I can now only ever see 5, even at feeding times (which now are quite excited and everyone hovers by the top of the tank ready for food). I can’t think of where it could be, similar to the ottos, as I haven’t seen a dead one and I’m sure I brought 6, had 6 in the bag and put 6 in.... any thoughts on that one?
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: fcmf on August 27, 2019, 01:32:06 PM
Very good - they do indeed look like harlequins now. What temp do you keep them in, out of interest?

As for the missing cardinal, have you checked behind (or even in) the filter? When my neon green rasboras were in the quarantine tank, they had a habit of somehow squeezing themselves between the tiny suction cups on the back of the filter into a gap that didn't look at all possible for even a needle/pin to fit behind. Fish are notorious at ending up in places that only complete removal of filter or ornaments finally reveals their hiding places - but be careful not to inadvertently squash them or lift them out in the ornament (and resulting in them landing on the floor), if they're simply hiding/stuck.
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Matt on August 27, 2019, 01:52:14 PM
If it has passed, their tank mates may have eaten it... you may never find a trace. This has happened to me a few times in a heavily planted tank where spotting all the fish to do a roll-call is nearly impossible.
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on August 27, 2019, 03:13:44 PM
If it has passed, their tank mates may have eaten it... you may never find a trace. This has happened to me a few times in a heavily planted tank where spotting all the fish to do a roll-call is nearly impossible.

I did consider that, especially with the ottos as they’re much more likely with their hiding. But the cardinal disappeared a day or two after being introduced and I didn’t think it would have been eaten so quickly would it?
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on August 27, 2019, 03:15:48 PM
Very good - they do indeed look like harlequins now. What temp do you keep them in, out of interest?

As for the missing cardinal, have you checked behind (or even in) the filter? When my neon green rasboras were in the quarantine tank, they had a habit of somehow squeezing themselves between the tiny suction cups on the back of the filter into a gap that didn't look at all possible for even a needle/pin to fit behind. Fish are notorious at ending up in places that only complete removal of filter or ornaments finally reveals their hiding places - but be careful not to inadvertently squash them or lift them out in the ornament (and resulting in them landing on the floor), if they're simply hiding/stuck.

I’ve just checked behind the filter, it hangs on the rim of my tank but no luck and I shone my phone torch into the filter (didn’t want to disturb the filter media too much) and still nothing. He must have died and been eaten, possibly by the snails who have made themselves at home in my tank! I’ve ordered some Assassin Snails to deal with that problem so they should be here soon.

The heater is set for 25°c however my digital thermometer which is on the other side of the tank normally shows the water is at about 25.5°c when it’s cooler. On warm days like yesterday it got up to about 27.2°c I believe. It’s probably not good for it to go up so high but I can’t think of ways to keep it cooler. At the moment, it’s sat at 26°c exactly. However it probably is a bit too warm for all my fish really, should I turn it down a bit?
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Matt on August 27, 2019, 08:20:08 PM
I did consider that, especially with the ottos as they’re much more likely with their hiding. But the cardinal disappeared a day or two after being introduced and I didn’t think it would have been eaten so quickly would it?

I would guess that within 48hrs there might not be much left to find...
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Matt on August 27, 2019, 08:26:48 PM
The heater is set for 25°c however my digital thermometer which is on the other side of the tank normally shows the water is at about 25.5°c when it’s cooler. On warm days like yesterday it got up to about 27.2°c I believe. It’s probably not good for it to go up so high but I can’t think of ways to keep it cooler. At the moment, it’s sat at 26°c exactly. However it probably is a bit too warm for all my fish really, should I turn it down a bit?

Technically it should make no difference if the heater is turned down or set at the same level... if the tank water is hotter the heater should not come on.

A couple of ways you can cool the tank are to float frozen bottles of water in the tanks, to do water changes on hot days, and to run a fan across the surface of the water (more effective than it sounds!)
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on August 27, 2019, 08:38:51 PM
I saw those methods actually in another post and when it got really hot for a while in the UK I did end up leaving the lid open with a fan blowing towards the tank (not directly onto the water though as it wasn’t high enough and I tried putting some ice cubes in too but it didn’t make much of a difference. I’ll have to try it with the water bottles instead.

I did kinda mean the temperature the heater is set at though, do the fish I have need cooler water than the 25.5°c which I see it at the most when it’s cool?
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Matt on August 27, 2019, 08:44:19 PM
The fiah profiles on this site give the recommended temperature ranges of the fish. You'll need to strike a good balance between the needs of your species but I would guesstimate they can probably deal with a little cooler if my memory of your stocking serves me right! (Just noticed this thread is 20 pages long!!)
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on August 27, 2019, 08:46:17 PM
Also, I know I just got my cardinals and I’ll change the filter media in 5 or 6 weeks but I was thinking ahead about a feature fish for my tank. My dad tells me to get an Angelfish because he thinks they look pretty but I’m 99.9% sure that my tank isn’t deep enough. I was originally thinking about a Betta fish, which is why I chose Harlequins and Cardinals as I heard they’re less likely to nip but as I watch them, the more I think the faster pace of my tank would just be too much for one. My cardinals are quite speedy and the Harlequins can certainly move when they want! (They all actually have an interesting dynamic in the tank with the Harlequins forming a loose group in the dead centre of the tank and the Cardinals vaguely surrounding them)

Do you have any suggestions that would be suitable? With my 9 Harlequins, 5 (I may make it up to 6, depending on whether or not adding 1 individual into a shoal is recommended) Cardinals and my 2 otos, I don’t know how much extra space I have in my 64litre (technically, my filter, heater, plants and decor take up a lot of room but I’m not good with numbers so not sure what the tank is more like). If my Harlequins give me another 4 babies then my plan would be to find a new home for the 6 babies, which would leave me with a happy 7.

Any suggestions or comments on anything here would be helpful :)

Addition for your last post Matt, my stockings currently stand at 9 Harlequin Rasboras, 5 Cardinal Tetras and 2 Otocinclus and the tank is 61cm long, 44cm wide and 33cm deep
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: fcmf on August 27, 2019, 10:24:06 PM
An angelfish requires a tank of 100cm in length (100x40x50cm) and has a tendency to eat small fish like tetras or harlequins, so definitely not a suitable option.

If I were you, for a tank of that size, I'd keep all your harlequins including the babies, increase the number of cardinals to 9 as well, and it would make a lovely tank as it is.  The colour of the cardinals and the patterning of the harlequins, with their increase in numbers, would make a very visually attractive tank - no need for a feature fish as well as them and the otos.  If you were absolutely determined to have a feature fish, though, then a honey gourami might be a nice suitable option.
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on August 27, 2019, 11:50:25 PM
An angelfish requires a tank of 100cm in length (100x40x50cm) and has a tendency to eat small fish like tetras or harlequins, so definitely not a suitable option.

If I were you, for a tank of that size, I'd keep all your harlequins including the babies, increase the number of cardinals to 9 as well, and it would make a lovely tank as it is.  The colour of the cardinals and the patterning of the harlequins, with their increase in numbers, would make a very visually attractive tank - no need for a feature fish as well as them and the otos.  If you were absolutely determined to have a feature fish, though, then a honey gourami might be a nice suitable option.

They definitely do look stunning in the setup I’ve got, I’ll admit but I feel like a lot of the space is wasted... the Harlequins band together right in the centre of the tank and the cardinals seem to want to be there too apart from occasionally dipping behind the plants or hovering in the space below the filter so my thoughts were that a feature fish would encourage them to make use of the whole of the tank and not just the centre of it because it seems a shame that there’s a fair amount of space that just never seems to be occupied (I know that not all the space should be occupied at one time of course)
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on November 15, 2019, 03:51:36 PM
Little update as it’s been a while since you guys have heard from my tank! After losing one adult Harlequin Rasbora, the other 5 adults and 3 babies seem to have adapted well. They’re all still swimming happily together in the middle of the tank.
Despite having only 4 Cardinal Tetras (which have amazing colouring!), they seem to be quite confident and are very happy to be seen in all area of the tank.
My plants are doing ok but I’ve had to take one or two out and have now been replaced with others so I stand at 4 types of plants alongside a big hunk of floating water sprite which is doing amazingly. It’s put down some really quite long roots and has quite a lot and the Cardinals in particular (and the baby Harlequins) enjoy swimming through the roots after their feeding time. I only have one water sprite shoot in there as it’s quite big and if I had more, it limits the amount of light the plants at the bottom get.
I’m still struggling with snails (the Assassin snails did nothing to help before unfortunately dying) but they’re not causing a problem so far.
Two days ago I changed out the other half of the filter media as suggested a while back so it’s now all sponge. I also gave the used filter media to my sister in a hopes it will give her next fish a better chance of surviving since she’s running her filter with that for a time before getting the fish. I realise it might just kill the bacteria to go into colder water but worth a try I suppose.
Once the 6 weeks is over, I plan to get another 4 Cardinals to boost their numbers so will have equal numbers of Cardinals and Harlequins, having abandoned a hope of a suitable feature fish.
There is a chance we will be moving house soon however and there may be a possibility of a second tank for a Betta or if not, I hope to get one once I have set up residence in Newmarket alongside my existing tank.
Hope you enjoy the update, let me know if you have any questions or if anything I said could be improved.
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Matt on November 15, 2019, 08:51:08 PM
The floating plants will have access to atmospheric co2 and more light so tend to grow much faster. They can also be used very effectively to monitor for any deficiencies which would show up here before they would in the slower growing submerged plants.
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on November 16, 2019, 08:54:34 AM
The floating plants will have access to atmospheric co2 and more light so tend to grow much faster. They can also be used very effectively to monitor for any deficiencies which would show up here before they would in the slower growing submerged plants.

Oh that’s interesting! It seems pretty healthy and happy, the only thing I do have to be careful with is that it doesn’t block all the light for the other plants.
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Sue on November 16, 2019, 10:29:00 AM
Fish also appreciate floating plants as most of the fish we keep come from rivers etc with overhanging vegetation.

You could construct a barrier to hold the floating plants at one side of the tank if the filter outflow doesn't do this already. Though you may find the fish stay down at the dimmer end of the tank.
Title: Re: Beginner - New to fish keeping, would like some help and advice :)
Post by: Alostangel on November 16, 2019, 06:23:32 PM
Fish also appreciate floating plants as most of the fish we keep come from rivers etc with overhanging vegetation.

You could construct a barrier to hold the floating plants at one side of the tank if the filter outflow doesn't do this already. Though you may find the fish stay down at the dimmer end of the tank.

It’s over one side now anyways as I’ve angled it that way. It doesn’t cause a problem at all and I think makes feeding less scary to the fish as they have the safety of the roots just under where the feeding space is