Author Topic: Losing a couple of fish (Read 16666 times) 35 replies

Marcus_F · « **on:** February 17, 2020, 08:00:05 PM »

Hi all,

Tank has been going well, 5 months in and now at about 75% fish capacity. Have lost two fish in 6 days and a tad concerned.

I don’t see any worries with fish until they were floating at the bottom.

Water change yesterday with ammonia and nitrite at 0% Nitrate is around 30ppm but my tap water is 20ppm. No issues in smaller tank with same tap water. Change roughly 25% of the water twice a week but just got a larger bucket to help increase this %

So question is, can I test or check for anything else or is it a case of these things happen?

I started reading about Oxygen and wondering if it’s lack of in the water. Now I worry the moment a fish goes near the surface thinking he needs air.

Fish are:

Dwarf Rainbowfish (5) lost one last week
Rosy Tetra (2)
Cardinal Tetra (13) 10 added yesterday
Cherry Barb (

lost one today
Black neon tetra (5)
Black widow terra (5)

jaypeecee · « **Reply #1 on:** February 17, 2020, 08:35:47 PM »

Hi @Marcus_F

For convenience, would you mind reminding us of a few basics:

1 Tank volume
2 Tank pH
3 Tank KH
4 Tank GH
5 Planted?

That'll do for starters.

JPC

Marcus_F · « **Reply #2 on:** February 17, 2020, 08:40:19 PM »

Sure...

1 Tank volume 170L (cube though)
2 Tank pH high can’t recall figure think it was 9.
3 Tank KH
4 Tank GH
5 Planted? Yes

jaypeecee · « **Reply #3 on:** February 17, 2020, 08:45:47 PM »

Hi @Marcus_F

What about KH and GH?

JPC

Marcus_F · « **Reply #4 on:** April 11, 2020, 03:24:57 PM »

Hi,

It seemed to stable, not lost any in a while but now in the last three weeks I've lost two fish to what I'm sure is swim bladder disorder. Two weeks ago one Dwarf Rainbowfish swam directly under my flow of water as I was adding it back in from a water change. Instantly causing the upside down swim and floating about in the plants. Not sure if this was 100% the cause or if it accelerated a pre existing issue but I've since changed the way I add water back to the aquarium, now using a small bowl on the surface to catch the water and disperse eradicating almost all the large air bubbles.

A week later, one of the Black Widow Tetra's started floating badly and stuck in plants. Now today I've just seen one of the cherry barbs is floating unnaturally, not as bad as the previous two but from my untrained eye it does appear to be the same thing.

I've read a lot about it last week or so and have all sort of possibilities. Could it be the dried flake food diet they all have but it's not changed the food since September when first fish went in. The water flow is fairly high I think, got a Fluval 307 for 170litre tank but again it's been that pressure for a while.

I got worried that my oxygen levels could be too low so I now have a bubble wall (7cm) along the back, don't suppose this could be causing issues? This has been going for hmmm roughly 8 weeks and problems only been happening last 2 or 3 weeks.

Water testing has always been good, zero ammonia and nitrite. High nitrate tap water means I switched to a Pozzani Nitrate Removal Filter and it's working great. Nitrate originally would sit around 45ppm after water is now at 10ppm and has been for two weeks.

Not sure how I test my water for KH and GH readings but I do know it's classed as VERY hard.

Anything that springs to mind I can check? Do I need the bubble creator on, should I turn it off to be safe?

Marcus_F · « **Reply #5 on:** April 11, 2020, 03:33:03 PM »

I use the api solution test kit for the three main chemicals and PH but just found some old test strips so have some more results.

GH is >14D or possibly 21D so very hard.
KH is around 10 - 15D

Marcus_F · « **Reply #6 on:** April 12, 2020, 05:34:35 PM »

Poor thing is swimming loop the loops. Done a water change today. 0 ammonia, 0 nitrite, 10ppm nitrate

PH is 8.2 and above KH and GH still stand.

fcmf · « **Reply #7 on:** April 12, 2020, 06:27:14 PM »

Apologies that no-one has got back to you before now.

Water quality is good.
Water maintenance regime seems fine (assuming that you rinse out the filter media in being-discarded tank water rather than running it under the tap) and the new method of replenishing water is sensible.
Feeding regime could possibly be improved to have 1-2 days a week of some veg such as pea (shell off, each half chopped into tiny morsels) or frozen/live food such as brineshrimp (once shops re-open to permit its purchase) but I don't think it per se is accounting for your problems.
Bubble wall might be helpful but unlikely to be harmful.

However, what does leap out to me is that your fish are soft water fish but you have hard water. This can cause all sorts of health problems eg osmotic stress, kidney damage, immune system functioning and in turn premature disease/death. In CaCO3 (ppm) and German degrees hardness, what does your utility website say your readings are for your postcode? It would then be worth cross-checking the various species' profiles at https://www.seriouslyfish.com/knowledge-base/ to see if your water hardness is within the range required by each fish - they generally do best somewhere near the middle of the range rather than the extreme. If your fish are at or beyond the upper range, there are options available to soften the water, although others on here would be better placed to advise on that.

Marcus_F · « **Reply #8 on:** April 12, 2020, 06:59:46 PM »

Thanks for the reply, yep sponges gently squeezed in removed tank water.

Found my old post on tap water hardness...

Total Hardness: 340 mg/l
Degrees English (or Clarke) 23.8
Degrees German 19.04

Water hardness here is a right pain for all things from kettles, showers and fish water.

I’ll use that site you posted to cross reference the fish and what hardness they can cope with.

Marcus_F · « **Reply #9 on:** April 12, 2020, 08:43:17 PM »

Ok done some research and worked out my ppm CaCO3 hardness level is 339. Some fish in the knowledge base have a value of say up to 15oH, what is that figure? I can't find that value anywhere to convert it to CaCO3.

So next question, is there a way to reduce the hardness and PH? I'm reading that CO2 could be the way forward? This would aid the plants too, so maybe it's worth investing in an automated CO2 machine.

Am I on the right path or should I give up with that idea. I'd prefer to keep away from RO water and needing to purchase it over and over and I'm not too keen on installing to my current home pipework.

fcmf · « **Reply #10 on:** April 12, 2020, 09:31:15 PM »

The 15'H is actually 15 degrees German hardness. (Incidentally, this might be helpful: https://www.thinkfish.co.uk/calculators/hardness-conversion)

I'll defer to the others like @Littlefish and @jaypeecee who have hard water and would be able to advise much better than I can on your options.

Matt · « **Reply #11 on:** April 13, 2020, 04:37:35 AM »

Whilst I don’t have super hard water I can definately advise that a co2 system is not going to help with this. RO can be a painful option but it is also one of the easiest for the problem you are facing unfortunately hence it’s popularity. The other way you could go it collecting rain water... would you see this as a more attractive option?

jaypeecee · « **Reply #12 on:** April 13, 2020, 09:52:19 AM »

Quote from: fcmf on April 12, 2020, 09:31:15 PM

I'll defer to the others like @Littlefish and @jaypeecee who have hard water and would be able to advise much better than I can on your options.

Hi @fcmf and @Marcus_F

Although my tap water is indeed hard, I do not currently use tap water in my tanks. To date, I use remineralized RO water, the only painful bit of which is carrying it in 12.5 litre or 25 litre containers! But, it's not so easy (or wise) to obtain RO water whilst we are still in the midst of a pandemic! Of course, there is always the option of using an RO filtration system at home. I also know lots of people who use rainwater quite successfully. This is mixed with tap water to achieve the desired hardness.

JPC

Marcus_F · « **Reply #13 on:** April 13, 2020, 10:19:49 AM »

Thanks I might have to look at RO water from our local place. I do 35litre water change twice a week for the 170L tank. What sort of dilution should I be looking at for RO water? 50/50 or is it quite affective a reducing hardness so only need say 25%.

I’ve tried rainwater, collection is the problem. Did collect a fair amount over winter but it’s stopped raining for now and I ran out.

I also stopped using it as the water was a little green, soon cleared with filter and I was unsure how long the stagnant rainwater could stay collected and used. I didn’t want it to go funny and contaminate the tank.

jaypeecee · « **Reply #14 on:** April 13, 2020, 10:20:06 AM »

Quote from: Marcus_F on April 11, 2020, 03:33:03 PM

I use the api solution test kit for the three main chemicals and PH but just found some old test strips so have some more results.

Hi @Marcus_F

Please do not put any trust in old test strips. Aquarium hobby test strips are often questionable but old hobby test strips are in need of replacement. And, in this instance, I would suggest that you use the API KH and GH liquid test kits. I use them myself.

JPC

jaypeecee · « **Reply #15 on:** April 13, 2020, 11:51:39 AM »

Quote from: Marcus_F on April 12, 2020, 08:43:17 PM

Ok done some research and worked out my ppm CaCO3 hardness level is 339. Some fish in the knowledge base have a value of say up to 15oH, what is that figure?

Hi @Marcus_F

15^o carbonate hardness (i.e. 15dKH) is 270ppm (CaCO₃) - give or take a gnat's whisker. In order to convert from dKH to mg/l (same as ppm), simply multiply by 17.9.

JPC

jaypeecee · « **Reply #16 on:** April 13, 2020, 12:20:45 PM »

Quote from: Marcus_F on April 13, 2020, 10:19:49 AM

I do 35litre water change twice a week for the 170L tank.

Hi @Marcus_F

May I ask why/how you decided on this amount at this frequency? That's roughly 20% twice a week. Seems a bit excessive to me but, if you're OK with this, then fine.

JPC

Marcus_F · « **Reply #17 on:** April 13, 2020, 01:22:26 PM »

The water change is that level as my tap water nitrate is very high 40ppm so need to keep it frequent to keep it at a level.

Now I’m adding 0 nitrate water I can reduce water changes but only done 4 0 nitrate changes so haven’t changed frequency. Now the tank level is down to good nitrate levels I’ll reduce water changes to once a week 30litres.

daveyng · « **Reply #18 on:** April 13, 2020, 05:36:07 PM »

The tap water in our area has nitrates around the 40 ppm mark. I use 50/50 RO tap to reduce this (and the hardness).

jaypeecee · « **Reply #19 on:** April 13, 2020, 06:47:20 PM »

Quote from: Marcus_F on April 13, 2020, 01:22:26 PM

The water change is that level as my tap water nitrate is very high 40ppm so need to keep it frequent to keep it at a level.

Now I’m adding 0 nitrate water I can reduce water changes but only done 4 0 nitrate changes so haven’t changed frequency. Now the tank level is down to good nitrate levels I’ll reduce water changes to once a week 30litres.

OK.

JPC

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Losing A Couple Of Fish

Losing A Couple Of Fish

Author Topic: Losing a couple of fish (Read 16666 times) 35 replies

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