Fish Recommendations For A Complete Newbie?

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Offline bellaonline

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Fish recommendations for a complete newbie?
« on: March 16, 2015, 06:19:39 PM »
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Hello all, complete newbie here, thanks for having me!

After lusting after other people's aquaria for years, even decades, I have finally managed to persuade my partner to buy me one for my birthday.

It's an Eheim Aquabay 104l, and it's currently sitting empty and splendid on the side, ready to be started up.
I've done a lot of reading around getting started, so am pretty happy with what I need to do, but the choice of fish (when I get to that point) is a bit overwhelming!

Can anyone suggest what kinds of fish would be good to form a healthy community tropical tank?  I think like a lot of newbies I love the pretty fish (blues, yellows, reds and oranges) and would love shoaling ones all darting about.
I live in London where the water is quite hard (Thames Water say 262ppm or 15DH), and also apparently the pH can be around 8 or even a bit higher.

When we went to look in the shop there were some I liked the look of (not sure what they were) but the guy told me that if I wanted those ones I would have to buy my water in as the pH of the tap water was wrong for them.  As there were quite a few that fitted that category I was wondering if it was worth doing that (could get expensive and be a hassle?) as if I don't do that quite a lot of pretty fish were ruled out.

Does anyone have experience of doing this and can you suggest what fish I should start with if I don't?  I obviously need to decide this before I get going as it will depend what water I put in the tank to start off with.

Thanks in advance for your help. Very excited!

Offline Sue

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Re: Fish recommendations for a complete newbie?
« Reply #1 on: March 16, 2015, 06:48:31 PM »
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Hi and welcome  :wave:

With hard alkaline water you need to look at fish like livebearers which do come in bright colours. Fish like endlers, guppies and platies would all be fine in that tank; swordtails might be a bit big.
There are a few shoaling fish that are fine in hard water eg lemon tetras, x ray tetras, fortail blue eyes (also called forktail rainbowfish).

It is fish like neon tetras (the blue and red ones) that would be a problem; in order to keep those you need soft acid water. You would need to use RO water, either all RO with some remineralisation salts added, or a mix of RO and your hard tap water. RO stands for reverse osmosis and is water that has had all the minerals removed. Even soft water fish do need some minerals which is why you'd have to add some with 100% RO. This is what the man at the shop was talking about. You can buy you own machine but it is very wasteful of water if you are on a meter.
I will be honest and tell you to get some experience with fishkeeping before going down this route.

There is a Community Creator on this site which will help with fish numbers. Click on 'fish profiles' at the top of the page, click on any fish and scroll down to the bottom of the page.

I have the Eheim aquastar tank. The company sell it as a 54 litre tank, but that is the volume of the entire tank. You have to leave a gap on top of the water or it would overflow. You may well find that your aquabay is the same. My tank is in my signature as 50 litres but by the time I put in a substrate and some decor it actually took 45 litres to fill it. Just to warn you not to stock it as though it holds 104 litres of water!



Have you read up on fishless cycling yet? It sounds complicated but is much safer for the future fish and much easier for the fishkeeper.

Offline bellaonline

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Re: Fish recommendations for a complete newbie?
« Reply #2 on: March 18, 2015, 11:20:37 AM »
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Thanks Sue, very helpful... so I'm getting the impression that at this stage it's better to go with tap water and whatever fish I can get that will be happy with that. 
Done lots of reading and ready to go with the fishless cycling.  We are going to go and buy substrate, conditioner, decor, plants etc this weekend.   One further question about that... can I put the plants straight in or do I have to wait for the cycle to get going before I can put the plants in?
I'm off on holiday on Wednesday so hoping to set it all up before I go, leave my partner (who has a chemistry degree) to keep an eye on it while I'm away, and have it ready for the first residents by the time I get back! 

Offline Richard W

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Re: Fish recommendations for a complete newbie?
« Reply #3 on: March 18, 2015, 11:50:47 AM »
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Some people say that you should leave the plants out until the cycle is finished as the plants may "interfere" with the results of your tests  since they will use up some of the ammonia, nitrites and nitrates. Personally I think this is (as is a lot of advice about fishkeeping) "much ado about nothing". If you put the plants in first, they will be established by the time you get your fish. Plants are very beneficial and having them growing away early is valuable. It is much easier to plant them, before you fill the tank. Put in the substrate and an inch or two of water, then the plants. Fill up the tank carefully, trying not to uproot the plants. If you leave the planting till later, you will find it much harder to get the plants in, you have to put your arm into the water, it's more difficult to see where you are putting them and they tend to float away.

I'd advise buying cheap easy plants, the expensive ones that come in pots are often difficult to grow. Things like Vallisneria, Sagittaria and Hygrophila are easy, as is Java Fern tied to bogwood.

Offline Sue

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Re: Fish recommendations for a complete newbie?
« Reply #4 on: March 18, 2015, 12:45:25 PM »
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The current thinking about plants is to put them in first, wait until they are growing well, then add ammonia to start the cycle. The reason for waiting for the plants to establish themselves is that you don't want to add ammonia and then have the plants die as that will complicate the cycle.
The method written up here for fishless cycling uses 3ppm. The older method used 5ppm, which we now know is far to much; a sensibly stocked tank will never make that much ammonia in a day so we don't need to grow enough bacteria to deal with that amount. 5ppm was quite a lot of ammonia and is high enough to harm some plants.

Plants use ammonia as food and with healthy plants you don't need as many bacteria to 'eat' the ammonia made by the fish or from a bottle during cycling. You may well find that if you do decide to plant then wait before adding ammonia that the cycle will proceed faster because of the plants.
Of course, if you don't want to wait for the plants to become established - I've seen 3 weeks quoted as the typical time - you can start cycling without and plant them later.


If you have abranch of The Range near you, I understand they sell ammonia suitable for cycling. Fish shops don't sell it!

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