Feeding

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Offline Billy

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feeding
« on: January 08, 2013, 08:16:02 PM »
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How much food should i be giving at the moment ??  ??? :-[ :-\ . I think i should be feeding a small amount at a time but is it daily or evey other day ? I have put a little bit in every evening so far and they act like piranhas and finish the lot in seconds. Also the biggest of the three bullies the others out of the way, how can i get the smaller ones a chance ?

A Selection of Fish in my Fish Community Creator Tanks
Neon Tetra (5) - Zebra Danio (2) - Japonica Shrimp (5) - Penguin Tetra (4) - Golden Barb (4) - Angelfish (1) - Black Molly (2) - Rosy Barb (7) - Guppy (male) (12) - Platy (4) -
Note: The user may not necessarily own these fish, these are tanks that they may be building or researching for stocking purposes


Offline Joker Fish

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Re: feeding
« Reply #1 on: January 08, 2013, 08:52:36 PM »
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I am having same problem  :). I started out feeding twice per day, I am now feeding them once every 2 days. The big one does chase off the little one, So I put in one flake, wait until the big one starts on it then drop in another. I have only had my fish for 5 days so I would also be interested in other more experienced fish keepers ideas.
 :)

Offline Billy

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Re: feeding
« Reply #2 on: January 08, 2013, 10:06:47 PM »
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i have done something similar, fed the big one first then the little ones in the corner where they get chased to . we have heard about increasing schoal to stop the bullying but are concerned about putting in too many too soon.

A Selection of Fish in my Fish Community Creator Tanks
Neon Tetra (5) - Zebra Danio (2) - Japonica Shrimp (5) - Penguin Tetra (4) - Golden Barb (4) - Angelfish (1) - Black Molly (2) - Rosy Barb (7) - Guppy (male) (12) - Platy (4) -
Note: The user may not necessarily own these fish, these are tanks that they may be building or researching for stocking purposes


Offline Scooter User

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Re: feeding
« Reply #3 on: January 09, 2013, 08:13:54 AM »
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What sort of fish have you got?  Cichlids can be very bullying of each other whereas naturally schoaling types like neons usually have a 'live free, food frenzy as a group' approach.  My old angels used to be devils for ganging up at feeding time.  Currently I have guppies and neons and while I don't get the same pleasing reaction from them - the angels would take flakes from my hand! - it is quicker to feed the groups.  If you have a community tank with bottom feeders don't rely on flake making it to them either!  We had Corys and used pellets that would sink immediately, fed at the same time as the flake.  The interesting thing was watching the Amano shrimp tuck it under an arm and try and leg it with the pellet  ;D

I tend now to take a pinch of flake and 'drizzle' it in a line across the tank.  Then each fish has a chance as something is nearby.  The key is to avoid overfeeding as this will soil the tank.  The advice I was given years ago when I started was don't give them more than they can hoover up in four or five minutes.  If they are underfed you can always drop a little more in later.  Overfeed and you will create problems in the water as the excess food breaks down.  I feed once a day - for my littlies I think this is enough.  The angels got fed twice a day (before I went to work and around 6.30pm when I got home).

Hope that helps.  If i have said anything here that anyone else disagree's with please put me straight - I'm going off my own experience and always welcome advice from any quarter. :D

Offline Sue

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Re: feeding
« Reply #4 on: January 09, 2013, 08:22:55 AM »
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Fish do need a lot less food than you'd think. Animals like us and our most common pets like cats and dogs use a huge amount of our food to keep ourselves warm. Fish don't keep themselves warm, they rely on their surroundings to do that, so a mouse sized fish doesn't need nearly so much food a mouse. We tend to think in terms of what we'd need, and end up over feeding.

As a very very rough guidleine, one fish needs as much food as the size of its eye. This really only applies to flake food, or maybe pellets, it doesn't really work with bloodworm or algae.
Fish always act as though they are starving. They don't have a mechanism that tells them they are full, and if you let them they could eat themselved to death.

When you are fish-in cycling like JokerFish, or still culturing your bacteria from a media donation like Billy, you do need to feed a bit less than that so that the ammonia level doesn't go up too quickly or the transplanted bacteria don't get too stressed. So either half the amount you should be feeding every day or the normal amount every other day.

JF - breaking the flakes up if they are big can also help, and scatter the bits. It will take the big molly longer to eat a whole flake that way, and the little one stands more of a chance. Did you know that mollies also like vegetables? Microwave a couple of peas in a bit of water, or save some from your meal, pop the insides out of the skin and chop them up till the bits are small enough for the small mollies mouth. One pea per fish. If there's any left on the bottom after a couple of hours, remove it.


Scooter User - I go by 'feed as much food that will be eaten in 2 minutes'. Though that does depend on what fish you have as some are very slow to realise there's food in the tank.

Offline Billy

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Re: feeding
« Reply #5 on: January 09, 2013, 07:57:49 PM »
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Thanks for all your advice. I have 3 leopard danios. one a bully, one that gets bullied when he tries to come out from his corner and a small one that you have to search to see if it is still there. ( normally under filter or at top of tank in somed weed ). I have been feeding every evening after work, about 3 or 4 flakes crushed into small pieces. I was spreading this along the tank but the big one seemed to get it all. I now put some in corner as well where the other 2 have to hide. I tested the water tonight, the amonia was 0 mg/l. The nitrite
was 0.3 mg/l is this ok ? If not any suggestions please  ;D

A Selection of Fish in my Fish Community Creator Tanks
Neon Tetra (5) - Zebra Danio (2) - Japonica Shrimp (5) - Penguin Tetra (4) - Golden Barb (4) - Angelfish (1) - Black Molly (2) - Rosy Barb (7) - Guppy (male) (12) - Platy (4) -
Note: The user may not necessarily own these fish, these are tanks that they may be building or researching for stocking purposes


Offline Sue

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Re: feeding
« Reply #6 on: January 10, 2013, 08:21:23 AM »
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With a nitrite above zero, you need to do a water change. Whenever you see either/both ammonia or nitrite above zero, do a water change. The nitrite eating bacteria are the more decicate ones. It sounds as though the ammonia eaters survived the transplant and are coping well with the danios, but the nitrite eaters had a bit of a setback. The fact that you did put bacteria in there with your friend's media means it won't take nearly so long as if you didn't have that media, so just hang on, doing water changes, till you get zero for both readings.

With 0.3, a two thirds water change will get it down to 0.1.


Once both readings have stayed at zero for a week without a water change, get another danio. Just one. Then a week later, if they stay at zero, get another two. That'll give you a shoal of six and any bullying that continues will be spread out over a bigger number of fish.
It is usually safe to add a third of the fish already in the tank, and one third of three is one. When you have four, it should be OK to add another 2 even though that will be half the number you'll already have, just keep an eye on the water levels just in case. Then with the next species you get, again get a third of the amount of already in the tank.

Offline Billy

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Re: feeding
« Reply #7 on: January 10, 2013, 09:45:36 PM »
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Finished water change and what a change it has made to fish ! They all seem much happier , the big one is even content to let other out and swim where they want. The little one is out of hiding and acting like a normal fish  :). I take it the nitrite level was stressing the fish ? how soon should i test water again, i guess tomorrow evening ?

A Selection of Fish in my Fish Community Creator Tanks
Neon Tetra (5) - Zebra Danio (2) - Japonica Shrimp (5) - Penguin Tetra (4) - Golden Barb (4) - Angelfish (1) - Black Molly (2) - Rosy Barb (7) - Guppy (male) (12) - Platy (4) -
Note: The user may not necessarily own these fish, these are tanks that they may be building or researching for stocking purposes


Offline Sue

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Re: feeding
« Reply #8 on: January 11, 2013, 04:56:43 PM »
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Yes, both ammonia and nitrite in the water stress the fish. Test every 24 hours, but if you find the reading for either of them is over 0.25 by the 24 hour reading, test every 12 hours and do water changes whenever you see readings above zero.

Offline Billy

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Re: feeding
« Reply #9 on: January 12, 2013, 09:35:46 AM »
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i did another water change as nitrite level still a bit high, and will check again this morning. going out to get a gravel cleaner this morning,are there any types to avoid?. i was thinking of a tetra one. one of the plants is dying so will remove it and replace with a new one. would this be an added reason for the high level of nitrite ( i believe the level rises with rotting food , though not sure ) Also shrimps are supposed to help keep the tank clean is it too early to get any yet ?

A Selection of Fish in my Fish Community Creator Tanks
Neon Tetra (5) - Zebra Danio (2) - Japonica Shrimp (5) - Penguin Tetra (4) - Golden Barb (4) - Angelfish (1) - Black Molly (2) - Rosy Barb (7) - Guppy (male) (12) - Platy (4) -
Note: The user may not necessarily own these fish, these are tanks that they may be building or researching for stocking purposes


TigzFish

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Re: feeding
« Reply #10 on: January 12, 2013, 11:17:14 AM »
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I personally would concentrate on getting the tank settled before contemplating adding any additional lifeforms. Small numbers of shrimp won't make that much difference for your current situation IMO, and the can poo for England too, meaning more work.

Offline ColinB

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Re: feeding
« Reply #11 on: January 12, 2013, 11:45:49 AM »
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Everything you could possibly want to know about shrimps (except recipies  ;)) is here in the articles section on the right:

http://www.planetinverts.com/

A Selection of Fish in my Fish Community Creator Tanks
Panda Cory (7) - Honey Gourami (3) - Ember Tetra (9) - Lemon Tetra (4) - Cherry Barb (1) - Otocinclus (2) -
Note: The user may not necessarily own these fish, these are tanks that they may be building or researching for stocking purposes


Offline Sue

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Re: feeding
« Reply #12 on: January 12, 2013, 12:30:49 PM »
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Shrimps are more sensitive to poor water conditions than fish, so definitely wait before getting them.

Plants decompose to make ammonia which is then turned into nitrite, then nitrate. As you seem to have a colony of ammonia eating bacteria any ammonia from dead plants will be getting stuck at the nitrite stage while you wait for enough nitrite eaters to grow.

Are you looking for a basic gravel cleaner or an electric/battery one? When I had gravel I used this type
http://www.wharfaquatics.co.uk/proddetail.asp?prod=WAQ9002
There are loads of makes on the market. Some have a one way valve at the top of the wide tube; you move the wife tube up and down quickly uner water to start the siphon. With the kind without the valve, you have to suck the other end to start the siphon. Just start the siphon them push the wide end into the gravel, wait till all the muck had been sucked up them move the tube to the next bit of gravel. Don't worry if you don't get round all the gravel the first time you do it.
I suggest you practice with a bucket of water first so you don't stress the fish  :)

Offline Helen

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Re: feeding
« Reply #13 on: January 13, 2013, 01:45:56 PM »
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Do you know what type of plant is dying? Cryptocornes suffer from something call 'crypt melt'. It will recover from this if you don't disturb the roots. But you do need to cut off the 'melting' leaves so they don't add to the ammonia load.

And live plants can help with controlling ammonia fluctuations, so it can be better to keep them if you can.

Offline Billy

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Re: feeding
« Reply #14 on: January 13, 2013, 09:05:43 PM »
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I'm not sure of the exact name of the plant but looking at a website of plants i think it is called amazon sword .After lifting plant out i noticed a few green shoots at bottom so cut off dying leaves and re planted it. I will definately keep live plants as i think they look better and tanks look better when they fill out. should i take plants out of pots or leave them in ? I have done two water changes in last few days and the last 2 readings have been zero for nitrite and amonia.  :) I guess i need to keep testing every evening for next few days to make sure all ok.

A Selection of Fish in my Fish Community Creator Tanks
Neon Tetra (5) - Zebra Danio (2) - Japonica Shrimp (5) - Penguin Tetra (4) - Golden Barb (4) - Angelfish (1) - Black Molly (2) - Rosy Barb (7) - Guppy (male) (12) - Platy (4) -
Note: The user may not necessarily own these fish, these are tanks that they may be building or researching for stocking purposes


Offline ColinB

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Re: feeding
« Reply #15 on: January 14, 2013, 07:47:24 AM »
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Most of the plants I've put in look like they're fading away at first - just hang on in there and they usually sort themselves out. You really don't want to disturb them if at all possible. Have your Swords got root tabs? - they do appreciate them as they tend to go a bit yellow without them, I think it's the iron they need in their 'diet'.

Another mistake that's easy to make is planting too deeply. Sometimes (often) it's a pain getting the plant to stay put in the substrate so it's tempting to push them in too deep. This can cause die-off initially too.

A Selection of Fish in my Fish Community Creator Tanks
Panda Cory (7) - Honey Gourami (3) - Ember Tetra (9) - Lemon Tetra (4) - Cherry Barb (1) - Otocinclus (2) -
Note: The user may not necessarily own these fish, these are tanks that they may be building or researching for stocking purposes


Offline Helen

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Re: feeding
« Reply #16 on: January 14, 2013, 12:43:47 PM »
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How long has the amazon sword been in your tank? I think nearly all types of amazon sword are grown for sale with their leaves out of the water. And apparently the leaves are different when grown out of the water and under the water. So it isn't unusual for the existing leaves on a newly planted amazon sword to die back. The plant will then grow new 'under water' leaves. These are probably the shoots that you have seen.

Again you did the right thing by cutting off the dying leaves and replanting it. The short disturbance shouldn't make much difference to the plant's growth in the short term and none in the long term.

I have to admit that I couldn't see the difference between the two types of leaves when my amazon swords did this.

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