Invertebrates And Soft Water

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Offline Trish

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Invertebrates and soft water
« on: April 04, 2017, 05:54:52 PM »
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Hi all,
I did some routine water testing today, and found that the water from my tap is considerably softer than it used to be.
It was 7 KH and 10 GH. It is now 3 KH and 7 GH.  Oddly enough the PH is still 7.6. Having done a few water changes recently, my tanks now have the same readings.
I'm a bit worried about my shrimps and snails getting enough calcium.
I have 2 nerites and 1 yellow rabbit snail, and 4 amano shrimp in my community tank.
I have been feeding shrimp pellets every  other night and I have just ordered some snail pellets that are supposed to be high in calcium.
Does anyone know if the calcium and mineral blocks that you can get are any good? I've also read about putting cuttlefish bone in the tank or a liquid calcium supplement.
Any help would be appreciated.

Offline Littlefish

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Re: Invertebrates and soft water
« Reply #1 on: April 04, 2017, 06:17:01 PM »
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Hi Trish,
I pretty much have almost liquid rock, so don't have this problem. I'm fairly certain that @Sue has softer water, and has been very successful with both shrimp and snails. I also think @fcmf and @Paddyc are in similar situations of softer water and invertebrates (who can forget Paddy's picture of Olaf with a malaysian trumpet snail on his bum  :rotfl: ), so perhaps they will be able to offer some advice.

Offline Sue

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Re: Invertebrates and soft water
« Reply #2 on: April 04, 2017, 06:51:27 PM »
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I do indeed have what my water company calls moderately soft water. They give my GH as 85 ppm and 4.76 German deg. They don't give alkalinity now - what water companies call KH - but their last table in 2010 gave my average hardness as the same as it is now, and KH as 83 ppm, or the same as the GH.

I have nerite snails and cherry shrimps.
The snails do suffer a bit from shell eroison but I bought some of them as long ago as July 2011 and they are still alive.
When I first got the shrimps I did have trouble keeping them alive but a shrimp expert member on here helped me through and said my GH was on the lowish side but still OK (It was most likely a shrimp specific bacterium that caused the problems)


If you do find the shrimps and snail suffering you can use cuttlefish bone to give them some calcium. i've also seen Tums indigestion tablets recommended - but I don't know if they are available in the UK.

Offline Trish

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Re: Invertebrates and soft water
« Reply #3 on: April 04, 2017, 07:13:53 PM »
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Thanks Littlefish and Sue.
I happen to have Tums in the cupboard, maybe I will give them a try. Then again.....maybe I am worrying about nothing, as other forum members are successfully keeping them in soft water.
I have only had the yellow rabbit snail for a few weeks, and I find it fascinating. They are lovely creatures. It's really amusing to see them gallumping across the aquarium, dragging that great big shell behind them.

Offline Littlefish

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Re: Invertebrates and soft water
« Reply #4 on: April 04, 2017, 07:53:52 PM »
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I don't know how accurate the information is on the MA site with regards to yellow rabbit snails, but it says that their water parameter requirements are quite soft water (<8 german degrees) with a pH of 7.5 - 8.5, so it looks as if your water isn't far off what is required to keep it happy, even without the Tums (unless it gets indigestion)  ;D
It might be worth having a look at a snail-specific site to double check.

Offline Trish

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Re: Invertebrates and soft water
« Reply #5 on: April 04, 2017, 08:36:21 PM »
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If it does get indigestion, I can always try Gaviscon :rotfl:
Thanks for the info, Donna, I'll have a trawl round t'internet for snail forums.

Offline fcmf

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Re: Invertebrates and soft water
« Reply #6 on: April 08, 2017, 04:16:51 PM »
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I don't actually keep invertebrates but I do have very soft water, hardened slightly by having some limestone/Tufa rock in the tank. Hope that suggestion is helpful.  :)

Offline Trish

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Re: Invertebrates and soft water
« Reply #7 on: April 09, 2017, 10:42:25 AM »
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Thanks fcmf,
Good idea, very helpful.

Offline Littlefish

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Re: Invertebrates and soft water
« Reply #8 on: April 09, 2017, 12:35:28 PM »
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Sorry @fcmf, I probably got confused with Fiona.

Offline Matt

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Re: Invertebrates and soft water
« Reply #9 on: April 13, 2017, 12:08:25 PM »
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My water provider has also updated my water stats table and they are now showing my water as moderately hard. It is right at the limit of the German blue rams acceptable range which is fortunate I suppose but does worry me... I sometimes wonder if they should do a aquarists e-mail drop or something... but we are probably one of many sensitive customers!!

Offline MarquisMirage

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Re: Invertebrates and soft water
« Reply #10 on: April 13, 2017, 06:17:55 PM »
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Mine have updated too.  Now showing as moderately soft at dGH 4.62.  But they seem to only count calcium in that figure.  Lucky that I've got a KH/GH testing.

Offline Sue

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Re: Invertebrates and soft water
« Reply #11 on: April 13, 2017, 07:01:26 PM »
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The calcium thing is just a way of expressing hardness. Hardness is made up of all divalent metal ions in the water and the majority is calcium ions, with magnesium ions as the next most common. The rest are there as trace amounts.
Because it would complicate things to say hardness is x with y as calcium and z as magnesium they express it as though it was all calcium.
This is according to the son who used to work for a water testing company.


Because everyone, from water companies to fishkeeping websites, use the same basis it doesn't matter if they 'pretend' that the magnesium component is calcium. All we need to know is which unit to compare our water value with those in fish profiles.

So far I have found hardness expressed as
mg/l CaCO3 (called ppm in fish profiles)
mg/l CaO
mg/l Ca
German degrees (also called dH in fish profiles)
Clarke degrees
French degrees
Grains per gallon (this is a American unit)

Offline MarquisMirage

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Re: Invertebrates and soft water
« Reply #12 on: April 13, 2017, 11:56:05 PM »
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You missed TDS (total dissolved solids).  Around 4.62 does sound right for the KH but the dH will most likely be around the 8 mark where it's always been.

Offline Sue

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Re: Invertebrates and soft water
« Reply #13 on: April 14, 2017, 10:07:57 AM »
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I didn't include it because total dissolved solids includes everything not just divalent metal ions. It includes all the organics from the fish and plants as well as mono and tri valent metal ions, and non-metal ions  :)

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