Tropical Fish Forum

Tropical Fish Keeping => General Fishkeeping Chat => Topic started by: Aquarius Barbara on September 22, 2017, 12:30:05 AM

Title: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on September 22, 2017, 12:30:05 AM
 Tomorrow I will be setting up my first tank for  :yikes: :yikes: :yikes: will be going out midday to get some plants so any suggestions would be welcome Alan is going to take time-lapse photos of how it goes, so you can all be totally shocked at what I do wrong, I know I will do something wrong  ::) ::)   I have everything I need except a syphon but that should be here I next couple of days so will manage until then with a jug.  I am so nervous I probably won't sleep tonight worrying and working out what to do.


Wish Me Luck Please.  ::) ::) :fishy1: :fishy1:
Title: Re: TOMORROW IS THE DAY YYYAAAYYY
Post by: Littlefish on September 22, 2017, 08:40:23 AM
Hooray, and good luck.  :cheers:

I'm sure everything will be fine, and I'm looking forward to seeing the pictures.  :)
Title: Re: TOMORROW IS THE DAY YYYAAAYYY
Post by: Sue on September 22, 2017, 09:11:35 AM
Good luck  :)


I would suggest plants but I only have the kind that attach to decor.

You won't need a siphon tube until you need to change some water.

Quick check list. Have you got:
dechlorinator
ammonia (and syringe to measure it with)
test kit

And bicarbonate of soda. I haven't mentioned that yet but it is because of your soft water. You may well have some in the kitchen. You'll need about two rounded 5 ml spoonfuls for 55 litres. Once the cycle is finished, you have to do a big (90% plus) water change which will remove all the bicarb.




Timetable:
Put sand in tank.
Put a few inches of water in tank and then plant the plants.
Add dechlorinator, enough to treat the final volume.
Mix some bicarb in a bit of water and add that to the tank.
Add the rest of the water. If you have a combi boiler, use hot and cold water to get the right temp. If you have a hot water cylinder in the airing cupboard, boil a kettle and mix that in.
Turn on the filter and heater.
*Add 1 ppm dose of ammonia. This is less than the method on here but you can't use 3 ppm with live plants as it could kill them.
Test ammonia after half an hour (so it has thoroughly mixed in) to make sure it really is 1 ppm.

During the cycle, test pH at the same time as ammonia and nitrite to make sure it doesn't drop. If it does, tell us. I can explain why if you want me too  ;)

* this bit can wait till next day if you are exhausted setting the tank up  :)



I find it easier adding water when there is sand in the tank using a colander. I run water into a bucket, adding dechlorinator at the correct dose for the amount of water in the bucket then use a jug to ladle the water into the tank. My colander is a 150 g yoghurt pot with hundreds of holes stabbed in it with a skewer. Other people put a plate on the sand and pour water on top of that. If you just pour it in you end up with a crater all the way down to the glass  ;D
Title: Re: TOMORROW IS THE DAY YYYAAAYYY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on September 22, 2017, 10:04:33 AM
Thank you Sue I had not come across the bicarbonate thing and have read and watched loads, so thank you for that.
 
I watched someone on YouTube use some bubble wrap to pour the water onto which obviously floats as the water fills up seems a good idea so going try that but I do have a couple of things I could use otherwise.

It is going to take me a couple of hours to wash everything once that is done I will pop out for plants while they are ( I know it seems daft but drying off)  but it will give me a rest as well, as I have very painful tennis elbow it will also give that a rest. Then when I get back I can start putting it all together, I have everything you have said so far.  Fingers crossed everyone.
Title: Re: TOMORROW IS THE DAY YYYAAAYYY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on September 22, 2017, 05:39:30 PM
Got back with plant only to find I have 2snails in shells what the h**l do I do with them ?.
Title: Re: TOMORROW IS THE DAY YYYAAAYYY
Post by: Sue on September 22, 2017, 06:53:20 PM
I know lots of people hate the sight of snails and want to keep their tanks as snail free zones, but they are actually a good part of the tank ecosystem. Being pest snails, they will survive cycling. (It's only the snails we pay good money for that can't cope with ammonia and nitrite  >:( )
These snails can become a nuisance if there are too many of them, and the reason for having hundreds of them is over feeding fish once you have them. They will also eat dead plants if you leave dead plants in the tank, and algae.

My recommendation about what to do is - nothing. Unless you really cannot stand them, leave them be, they are good for a tank.
If they ever get out of control, you could try a snail trap. This is a screw top jar with holes punched in the lid from the outside so that the spikes of metal go inwards into the jar. The holes should be big enough for snails to get through but too small for fish. Bait it with a piece of lettuce and place the jar on its side on the bottom of the tank last thing at night. The snails will go in through the holes in the lid to eat the lettuce but the metal spikes will stop them getting out. Then just remove the jar plus snails the following morning and dispose of the snails however you wish.
Or crush the snails against the tank wall, most fish will eat them.
You can buy chemicals to kill snails but I would not use these. Everything you add to a tank ends up inside the fish, and all these chemicals are not good for them. They will also kill any snails you want to keep, and shrimps.


I have those tiny spiral snails - a species of ramshorns - and the snails referred to as tadpole, bladder or trapdoor snails http://www.naturespot.org.uk/species/common-bladder-snail
Title: Re: TOMORROW IS THE DAY YYYAAAYYY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on September 22, 2017, 11:52:51 PM
WHAT A DAY!!!  ::)  Hi Well the day did not start well, woke up sneezing, coughing, hot/cold. then just has a couple of hours not sure how I was feeling. So Decided to just go out and get the plants first, I did put the tank on the patio with water in whilst I was out so we could make sure it did not leak.  Travelled over to Durham to Fish Alive and bought 3 different plants, 3 bunches of Lilaeopsis brasiliensis, 2 bunches of Cabomba Aquatica (which is where the snails were) and 3 bunches of Ludwigia Palustris Red. I was going to buy some fertilizer for the plants but I was put off a bit as straight away he plonked a £10 packet of plant pellets then some daily fertilizer he said I needed as well then a bottle of C02 stuff which was going to cost me nearly £40 in total, well I quickly refused and aid the £13.50 for my plants. I ended up at P@H and bought some weekly fertilizer that will last me about 15 weeks for £4.50, then to Poundland for a couple more buckets. Back home tank had not leaked so Had a quick lunch and a cuppa and got started, opened the plants and gave them a quick rinse (found the Snails) Panicked  :yikes: :yikes: came straight on here to see what I needed to do and thankfully Andy and Sue came to my rescue, so I put the plants into a tub of water along with the snails until I was ready for them. Then I set to cleaning everything and making sure everything was in working order. Then Stopped OMG.   ::) I had not thought about the fact I needed the electric extension in place before I started as once the tank was full I would not be able to move the unit it is standing on. So had another coffee whilst Alan sorted that out for me. Then the Build started,

(http://i68.tinypic.com/2qds6dc.jpg) 


(http://i64.tinypic.com/2kmpn4.jpg)


(http://i65.tinypic.com/5mkc9l.jpg)


(http://i63.tinypic.com/316akyc.jpg)


(http://i66.tinypic.com/2irsz0o.jpg)


(http://i65.tinypic.com/n4ifyh.jpg)


(http://i65.tinypic.com/2l9ssl.jpg)

Unfortunately, some of my photos did not turn out ok And Alan could not get his camera thing to work he needs to go back to the manual and learn a bit more. only had it a few months and not used it much yet. ::)

I stood back looking, thinking not bad Barbara for the first try,  then OMG I forgot the Bicarb quickly mixed it into some water and put it in. Set all the electrics going then collapsed on the settee absolutely Knacked nerves wrecked  :vcross:. Now What ................ 

Questions :
1, Do I leave the filter going all night,
2, Will there be enough food for the snails without any fish in.
3. Do I add plant fertilizer now or wait a couple of days,
4. Am I right in thinking I start testing water tomorrow giving it time to settle or have I got that wrong.
5. Can someone get me a large stiff drink Please?  :cheers:


Ok come on give me the low down is it a goer or a no goer  ::)
Title: Re: TOMORROW IS THE DAY YYYAAAYYY
Post by: Matt on September 23, 2017, 07:34:11 AM
Questions :
1, Do I leave the filter going all night,
2, Will there be enough food for the snails without any fish in.
3. Do I add plant fertilizer now or wait a couple of days,
4. Am I right in thinking I start testing water tomorrow giving it time to settle or have I got that wrong.
5. Can someone get me a large stiff drink Please?  :cheers:


Ok come on give me the low down is it a goer or a no goer  ::)

1. Yes, always and forever!! When you turn the filter off for any length of time the bacteria in the media stop getting fed ammonia from the tank and so start dieing off.
2. Is one of the snails in the 5th picture?  I'm trying to understand if the snails have a round garden snail like she'll or a come shaped shell.  Either way they arnt going to starve in the next few days so let me know on the above first.  Come shaped might want a little (very little) food, round will eat decaying plant material  (to set expectations you will probably get some die off initially)
3. Now :) be careful to get dosage right for tank size. And start with a half dose as you will probably get a algae or bacteria bloom when adding until the plants get more established.
4. Have you added the ammonia to 1ppm?
5. Bar not open untill 11:00 sorry  :rotfl:

What's the red substrate you've got?

Looks good :)
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Littlefish on September 23, 2017, 08:32:27 AM
Setting up a tank can be exhausting, but you should be very proud of yourself.  :cheers:
The tank looks great, and I like the way that you've got different areas with different substrates. Very pretty pebbles as well.

With regards to the snail pictured, it looks very much like an assassin snail to me, but you'd be better getting other opinions on that.

As for a drink, you deserve it after all of your hard work.  :)
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Sue on September 23, 2017, 09:14:41 AM
Well done, that's the really hard bit done  :cheers:

When you said snails in your other thread, did you mean the one in your photo that I have outlined in red below? That is a Malaysian trumpet snail. And in the photo above the one I tampered with, there is a second MTS half buried with the pointy end sticking up.
There are good snails, they keep the sand turned over. These won't starve. It is common for bits of plant to die off, and the snails will eat that.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Littlefish on September 23, 2017, 09:22:17 AM
My snail identification leaves a lot to be desired, sorry about that.  :-[  ::)
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on September 23, 2017, 09:24:18 AM
1. I switched it off back on now. oops, the first mistake,
2. The snails are in a cone-shaped shell,
3. Ok will do thank you,
4. Err,!! No but off to do it now,
5. Thanks had a V&C was very much needed!  ;)

The substrate is white sand and Aqua One Natural Gravel £4 per bag.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Sue on September 23, 2017, 09:52:47 AM
Filters and heaters should be left on 24/7 except for one occasion - during a water change.

If filters are run with the motor out of water it burns out the motor; and heaters turned on with the heating element out of water can explode.

Besides which, it is always a good idea to turn off electrical items before putting your hands in a tank of water  :)





However, those with external filters can leave those running during a water change provided the water level does not drop below the tube taking water from the tank to filter.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: fcmf on September 23, 2017, 10:16:16 AM
What might be helpful is to think of the filter as the fishes' life support machine - that way, it should be easier to remember that it needs to be on at all times. However, as Sue said, it should be switched off briefly during tank maintenance - but should be switched back on ASAP thereafter, in which case the analogy of the life support machine might be helpful as a reminder. At the moment, what you're doing is preparing the filter for doing its life support job for once the fish arrive ie processing their waste.

Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on September 23, 2017, 01:34:03 PM
All sorted now ammonia in fertilizer in filter back on electrics made more accessible, one snail not to be seen the other with shell half out of the substrate, just a little bit worried hope they are going to survive even though they are snails I would hate to think I have killed them. Hubby thinks I should have the lights closer to the tank thinks they are a bit high up. not sure but will see how it goes.

I would just like to thank everyone for their help. I think if I had not had the encouragement from you all and the great information from this forum. I would have totally chickened out. fingers crossed this is going to work out.

                                                                      :cheers:  THANK YOU BXX
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Sue on September 23, 2017, 01:52:50 PM
Malaysian trumpet snails (MTS for short, though not to be confused with the other MTS, multiple tank syndrome  ;D ) spend their days in the substrate. They come out at night though. And they also climb up the tank walls if there is something they don't like in the water so you may find them doing that now you have added ammonia. They will survive the ammonia, they'd survive a nuclear holocaust.

Once the tank is cycled and you have fish, if you ever see the MTS on the glass walls during the day, test your water straight away.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Matt on September 23, 2017, 05:05:51 PM
If the plants haven't grown after say a week move the light closer and wait another week to see if it helps.  Last thing you want is an algae bloom  ;)

Might be worth starting a log with what you do with the tank so you can track backwards if you need to.  In fish keeping ideally we change one thing at a time slowly and monitor the effects.

Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on September 23, 2017, 06:14:26 PM
I am not sure I have the filter set right, there is a lot of water spray coming up off the water even though I have the flow set downwards and it is very noisy I gave set it into the water at the minimum level with the Venturi set approx in the middle, but I have not moved the output flow control I will have to take the filter out to turn it down, not sure if I have this right can someone help, the water is still a bit cloudy even though I have put the fine filter sponge in as well.   Can anyone help me out please. Bx
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Sue on September 23, 2017, 06:51:15 PM
The cloudiness is either very fine dust from the substrate - so fine you couldn't see it in the wash bucket, but you can in the tank because there's more water in there and you are looking through it rather than down on it - or it could be the start of a bacterial bloom. Don't panic, these are very common in new tanks.
The bacteria we want to grow in the filter use chemicals based on nitrogen as food (ammonia, nitrite) and they multiply very slowly. They live in the biofilm which is attached to surfaces. But there are other bacteria which use carbon based chemicals as food, they live floating in the water and they multiply very quickly - and we can see them as a white mistiness.
All the new water you put in the tank contains some carbon based chemicals, as do all the plastic things in your tank (they contain plasticiser) and even the silicone joining the edges together contains them. The good news is that they will use up all their food and die off, but it is impossible to say how long this will take as every tank is different. It will be before the tank is ready for fish  :)




The filter -
You don't need to use the venturi, you can just remove the thin tubing from the filter. That will stop the bubbles. It's the bubbles that cause most of the spray - I know because I have a filter powered by an air pump in my betta's tank; this makes a lot of bubbles and a lot of spray. And bubbles make a noise.
If the filter makes a humming noise, that could be due to air caught in the impeller well. Tilt it side to side, and that should get rid of any air.
One thing I learned the hard way. If you ever do anything to the filter while it is running, don't point the outflow upwards. You'll get very wet  ;D
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on September 23, 2017, 07:35:03 PM
Ok think I have got it, My hubby is reading the manual as well so he can explain this to me as wel, I am not used to these kind of things but he is very hi tec so understands a bit better than do. Thanks Sue X
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Matt on September 28, 2017, 09:16:24 PM
How are your plants/filter flow/water cloudiness @Aquarius Barbara ?
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on September 28, 2017, 11:50:12 PM
Unfortunately, it was a big fail, I don't know what I did wrong as all tests were good. Then had a very very bad week with a poorly family member might get worse  :'(.  So it's all on hold again until the weekend.

But water clear snails still alive plants not too sure seem to be coming to bits. I will be back at the weekend as long as things do not get worse. Bx
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Matt on September 29, 2017, 06:17:57 AM
Sorry to hear about this, all the best to you and your family.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Sue on September 29, 2017, 10:11:54 AM
The family is more important than starting a tank, that can wait.

Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Littlefish on September 29, 2017, 04:28:14 PM
My thoughts are with you and your family.
Take care.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on October 03, 2017, 11:41:12 AM
Hi, All Thank you for your thoughts, She is still hanging on but still not good, I have an afternoon off so going to pick up some new plants, do a 90% water change (so the snails survive) take out all the dead plants and replant.
I have had the tank running all this time but the Ammonia level is far too high all others are ok. So hoping it will work out better this time.

Quick question before I go out.  Plants can survive without using plant substrate  I have just sand and gravel. but did put some fertilizer in. ?
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Sue on October 03, 2017, 01:32:07 PM
I'm sorry to hear your relative is so poorly.




Plants that are rooted in the substrate need root tablets. Some are better than others. For example, the API ones are notorious for disintegrating and making a mess of the water. If you can find them, Seachem root tabs seem to be one of the best.
If you have any plants like java fern or anubias, they can't be planted in the substrate so root tabs are no use. these need a liquid fertiliser that is added to the water. Seachem Flourish, with nothing else in the name, is one of the best as it contains virtually all the trace elements.

Aquarium plants like garden plants need both micro elements (trace minerals) and macro elements, the NPK that garden fertilisers talk about. Once there are fish in the tank the nitrogen of NPK comes from the ammonia made by made by the fish, and phosphorus and potassium are in fish food. As the moment you have no fish, so adding trace elements won't help. Until you start cycling properly it may help the plants if you add a bit of fish food - this will need to be removed when it goes mouldy, and it will probably increase the ammonia reading as well.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on October 04, 2017, 07:17:27 PM
 I tested the water that was in the tank before I started the change,
PH: 7.4
Ammonia: 8.0
Nitrate: 5.00
Nitrite 0.50

Took out all but a few centimeters of water, all the plants as they were just mush, cleaned the filter in the old water, (a bit to much dead plant matter clogging it up). Replaced the water adding 1ml de-chlorinator per 4.5L I did not put anymore bi-carb in, replanted new plants. tested water

PH 7.4
Ammonia: 2.oo
Nitrate: 4.00
Nitrite: 0

Switched everything back on and tested after 30mins.
PH: 7.4
Ammonia: 2.00
Nitrate: 4.00
Nitrite: 0

Do I add more ammonia or leave it for a few days and see how it goes. Bx
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Sue on October 04, 2017, 07:24:06 PM
Don't add any more ammonia if you have put new plants in. A lot of plant species don't like ammonia in their water. 2 ppm is fine for cycling, just start testing every third day till it drops below 0.5 ppm and nitrite is around the 2.0 level (I've said 0.5 ppm ammonia rather than 0.75 as in the how to article because you are starting with 2 ppm rather than 3 ppm)
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on October 04, 2017, 07:27:15 PM
what about my nitrate level should this be lower?
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Sue on October 04, 2017, 07:32:39 PM
What is your tap water nitrate? That's the lowest a tank can be unless there are a lot of plants. Since you've just removed some dead ones, they won't have affected the nitrate (if any) that came with the tap water you originally put in.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on October 04, 2017, 09:21:48 PM
I tested my water about 3 days ago and it read. Ph 7.0, Nitrate, 0, ammonia. 0.25, Nitrite 0.

The Only things I added to the water today were 1ml de-chlorinator per 4.5L then tested the water I have since put 10ml plant fertilizer into the tank. It was getting a bit dark when I tested it today, it looks like I have a full day at home tomorrow so will be able to do a good test in daylight.

The plants I have put in are, Cabomba, Ludwigia Repens, Cryptocoryne Parva. (no snails this time) LOL.  ;D
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Sue on October 04, 2017, 10:00:59 PM
Depending on the fertiliser, that could contain nitrate. Have a look on the label.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on October 04, 2017, 10:08:08 PM
ok, I will have a look thanks, (Love Fish Plant Food is nitrate and phosphate free). I have been looking at the fish to stock, the community this say this would be ok. 3 Cherry Barbs,  Ember tetras 4 white cloud mountain minnow.
As I have a small tank it won't take much more than this will stock at 72%. I was hoping to have one or two showy fish but can't find any for a small tank.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: fcmf on October 05, 2017, 08:05:17 AM
If your Aqua Nano is 40cm x 40cm x 40cm, then you might find the smaller species such as ember tetra best out of what you mention. Cross-check against seriouslyfish.com as it also advocates more detail on what the individual species require including minimum tank size dimensions, minimum shoal numbers, etc. However, with any of the ones you suggest, they're best kept in shoals and thus larger numbers than what you mention. If ember tetra were do-able, then keeping to the one species would create a very impressive display in the tank as they'd all show more natural behaviour by being kept in good sized numbers.

Hoping family situation is a little more settled - thoughts with you.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Sue on October 05, 2017, 10:27:08 AM
I would not keep white clouds with the other two species as they need a different temperature - white clouds are temperate fish while cherry barbs and ember tetras are tropical. And both white clouds and cherry barbs need a 60 cm long tank for the swimming length.
I know that the profiles on here say 30 cm is the minimum length for both cherry barbs and white clouds but to be honest they are quite out of date. I joined the forum in 2006 (on the previous host) and they had been written before that. I agree with fcmf that Seriously Fish is a much better source of up-to-date information.

A good sized group of ember tetras would be fine. If you could find any, green/false neons tetras (http://www.seriouslyfish.com/species/paracheirodon-simulans/) would be OK. They go well with ember tetras - I used to have them both. They have less red and more blue than standard neons. The way to tell the difference in shop tanks is that the blue stripe goes all the way to the tail while the stripe stops short of the tail with neons and cardinals. These do need a mature tank though so they should be added after the tank has been running a few months. They aren't in the fish profiles so I used neons instead in the community creator but put 4 neons for 6 green neons as they are smaller.


I have also read something interesting by a fish expert. With these small fish, they need to be in bigger groups than just 6. They get more stressed by small numbers than bigger fish. But these bigger shoals have less impact on the tank than the minimum number because of the stress chemicals released when there aren't enough of them.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on October 05, 2017, 02:16:48 PM
Been having a look but it is a bit tiring having to reload my tank dimensions all the time, also I have a poorly are (having an op next week) so cant do much browsing as it starts to hurt more.  I like the idea of possibly having just Emba tetras and maybe a specimen fish might have a look at the specimen fish to see if there is anything suitable for my tank.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Sue on October 05, 2017, 02:46:43 PM
When you say reloading your tank dimensions, do you mean in the community creator? If that is what you mean, you can save the tank. You do have to register separately from the forum (I use the same password to make it easier to remember  :) ) and log in to the CC each time, but it does save having to enter everything every time.

In a 40 cm cube, how about honey gouramis? These gouramis can be kept as a male/female pair.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on October 05, 2017, 02:50:05 PM
It was on Seriously Fish but I have come off, for now, I must admit I have not worked out how the community thing works as when I try to log in it always comes up as an error and that they have sent me an email which I never get.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Sue on October 05, 2017, 03:14:41 PM
With the CC log in, the email thing is broken so you have to contact the site owner Robert. Hover over the word members (in the list under your  user name at the top of the page), click on view members, then sort by position. Robert will be at the top, click on his email symbol. Just explain the problem and he'll sort it out.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on October 05, 2017, 03:20:35 PM
I have been back for another go and think I may have sorted it I gave my tank the name barbara's tank only put 2 Honey Gouramis and 10 Ember Tetras I think if these work out I will just stay with them for this tank and start work on my big tank once my arm has healed then look to bigger fish then. B xx
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on October 07, 2017, 02:13:23 PM
My fishless cycle re-start on the 4/10/2017
water reading
 I tested the water that was in the tank before I started the change,
PH: 7.4
Ammonia: 8.0
Nitrate: 5.00
Nitrite 0.50

Took out all but a few centimeters of water, all the plants as they were just mush, cleaned the filter in the old water, (a bit to much dead plant matter clogging it up). Replaced the water adding 1ml de-chlorinator per 4.5L I did not put anymore bi-carb in, replanted new plants. tested water

PH 7.4
Ammonia: 2.oo
Nitrate: 4.00
Nitrite: 0

Switched everything back on and tested after 30mins.
PH: 7.4
Ammonia: 2.00
Nitrate: 4.00
Nitrite: 0

7/10/20017
PH: 7.4
Ammonia: 1.00
Nitrate: 5.00
Nitrite: 0
I am worried that the Nitrate is going up, should I do anything. B xx
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Sue on October 07, 2017, 02:19:35 PM
Nitrate is very hard to judge - I'm surprised you could make it out as accurately as 4. My tap water is between the 0 and 5 colours so I just call that less than 5.
Nitrate is also the most difficult tester to make for home use, and is not terribly accurate because of this. An increase of 1 ppm is most likely to be due to the nature of the tester, and is still the same as the last test.

The main problem with nitrate testers is that one of the reagents doesn't dissolve. The reason that bottle has to be shaken well is to distribute the solid evenly through the liquid. It just takes one extra large particle to distort the results one way or the other.

My younger son who once worked for a water testing company considered our nitrate testers to be highly amusing  :-\
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on October 07, 2017, 02:24:58 PM
Nitrate is very hard to judge - I'm surprised you could make it out as accurately as 4. My tap water is between the 0 and 5 colours so I just call that less than 5.

That is why I said 4 as it is in between the two on the chart.

Do I need to add anything today, or are my readings ok. my Cryptocoryne Parva looks like it is dying off but the other plants are still looking good.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Sue on October 07, 2017, 02:33:52 PM
Wait 3 more days then test again. See what your ammonia reading is then. I know your ammonia has halved but that could be because your plants are using it as you don't have any nitrite yet. If it has dropped further in 3 days and still no nitrite, that will be the obvious conclusion.
But you'd still have to wait to get fish because the tank needs to be able to remove 2 ppm ammonia in 24 hours whether it is used by plants or eaten by bacteria.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Matt on October 07, 2017, 02:36:53 PM
The crypt will "melt" before sprouting again. It is a very common thing with this species of plant as it adapts following a move.  If you move it in the tank once its grown it will likely do the same again.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on October 07, 2017, 03:05:21 PM
Thank You I am a happy chappy   ;D  things look on the up.  :fishy1:
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on October 10, 2017, 05:23:49 PM
My fishless cycle re-start on the 4/10/2017
water reading
 I tested the water that was in the tank before I started the change,
PH: 7.4
Ammonia: 8.0
Nitrate: 5.00
Nitrite 0.50

Took out all but a few centimeters of water, all the plants as they were just mush, cleaned the filter in the old water, (a bit to much dead plant matter clogging it up). Replaced the water adding 1ml de-chlorinator per 4.5L I did not put anymore bi-carb in, replanted new plants. tested water

PH 7.4
Ammonia: 2.oo
Nitrate: 4.00
Nitrite: 0

Switched everything back on and tested after 30mins.
PH: 7.4
Ammonia: 2.00
Nitrate: 4.00
Nitrite: 0

7/10/20017
PH: 7.4
Ammonia: 1.00
Nitrate: 5.00
Nitrite: 0
I am worried that the Nitrate is going up, should I do anything. B xx


10/10/17
PH: 7.4
Ammonia:0
Nitrate: 7
Nitrite: 0

Do I now add 2ppm Ammonia?

Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Sue on October 10, 2017, 06:52:50 PM
Yes, add another dose of ammonia equal to 1 or 2 ppm not as the plants probably won't like it. But test every 2 days rather than every 3.

The nitrate increase form 4 to 7 is too small to measure accurately; I would just ignore it for now.

It is quite likely that the ammonia has gone into the plants. Unlike the ammonia eating bacteria, plants do not turn ammonia into nitrite, they turn in into proteins to make lots of new plant tissue. So don't worry if you never see nitrite; you need to wait until the plants can take up 2 ppm ammonia in 24 hours, that way you'll know that they can take up all the ammonia made by your first batch of fish. I seem to remember that you want to get fish slowly rather than a lot at once?


Since you haven't added any more bicarb, it would be a good idea to check your pH every time you do the other tests. That way you'll pick it up sooner if the pH does start to drop.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on October 10, 2017, 09:29:57 PM
Why do you add bicarb?
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Sue on October 10, 2017, 10:08:21 PM
In a plantless cycle, ammonia is turned into nitrite as bacteria grow to eat it, then on to nitrate as more bacteria grow to eat nitrite. Both nitrite and nitrate are acidic so they tend to make the pH drop.
Tap water has some carbonate in it; it comes from the rock the water flows over. Some places have a lot of carbonate because the reservoir or river flows over a lot of limestone. Other areas, like Northumbrian Water's Kielder Water doesn't sit on limestone so there is not much carbonate in the water.
Carbonates react with acid. If there is a lot of carbonate in the water, the amount of acidic nitrite and nitrate isn't enough to use up all the carbonate so the pH stays constant. But in places with very little carbonate it can all get used up and then there is nothing to stop the acids dropping the pH.

The problem during cycling is that our filter bacteria need carbonate to grow properly, and they need an alkaline pH. At below pH 6.5 they stop multiplying. And if there is not much carbonate in the water there may not be enough for the bacteria to grow well enough to multiply.

So in places where KH in tap water is low, it is easier to add bicarbonate of soda to artificially boost the amount of carbonate in the water. All the sodium in bicarb (the soda bit) is not very good for fish, but we do a big water change at the end of the cycle to remove all the nitrate the cycle has made and that also removes bicarb.

My KH (carbonate hardness) is 3 degrees. When I did a fishless cycle (no plants) in 2013, my pH dropped from 7.5 to below 6.



But when there are plants in the tank, they use ammonia as fertiliser. They don't turn it into nitrite or nitrate so there won't be as much acid formed. There will be a bit because of plant waste (yes plants do make waste just not on the scale of animals  :) ) so there is less risk of a pH crash than when there are no plants.
I didn't test my pH in 2013 until I realised that the cycle seemed to have stopped and that's when I found the very low pH. Your cycle with plants may never suffer a pH crash but as pH is the simplest of all the tests (no waiting 5 mins for the colour to develop) testing for pH when you test for all the others will catch the pH starting to fall if the does happen.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on October 13, 2017, 05:48:46 PM
My fishless cycle re-start on the 4/10/2017
water reading
 I tested the water that was in the tank before I started the change,
PH: 7.4
Ammonia: 8.0
Nitrate: 5.00
Nitrite 0.50

Took out all but a few centimeters of water, all the plants as they were just mush, cleaned the filter in the old water, (a bit to much dead plant matter clogging it up). Replaced the water adding 1ml de-chlorinator per 4.5L I did not put anymore bi-carb in, replanted new plants. tested water

PH 7.4
Ammonia: 2.oo
Nitrate: 4.00
Nitrite: 0

Switched everything back on and tested after 30mins.
PH: 7.4
Ammonia: 2.00
Nitrate: 4.00
Nitrite: 0

7/10/20017
PH: 7.4
Ammonia: 1.00
Nitrate: 5.00
Nitrite: 0
I am worried that the Nitrate is going up, should I do anything. B xx


10/10/17
PH: 7.4
Ammonia:0
Nitrate: 7
Nitrite: 0

Do I now add 2ppm Ammonia?
Added the Ammonia

Today's reading 13/10/17
PH: 7.4
Ammonia: 0.25
Nitrate: 10
Nitrite; 0.25

Added new plants and 10ml Fertilizer. (after tests done).

Snails very active above ground and climbing tank walls during the day, but not coming out of tank do I possibly need to put some food in for them or will there be enough plant matter for them to eat.?
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Sue on October 13, 2017, 08:13:58 PM
It looks like something is happening. You have a tiny amount of nitrite, possibly caused by the plants not using all the ammonia, and bacteria staring to multiply to eat the bit the plants don't use.

You could try adding a tiny bit of food for the snails. But what would be better is some vegetable matter. Depending what you have to hand in the kitchen, a thin slice of courgette or a thin slice of cucumber or a small piece of lettuce leaf. They will like it better if it is soft so blanch whatever you have in a bit of water in the microwave for a few seconds. You will need to weight it down, something like a small stone, or even sacrifice a teaspoon and use the handle to skewer the veg. Remove the veg after 24 hours or it will go off and make a mess of the tank - and confuse the cycle. Doing this once a week will be fine for snails.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on October 13, 2017, 09:08:22 PM
So I test again in 2 days to see if the readings have moved. I have put more plants in today, and now I have found what might be a baby snail n the glass, whatever it is it is moving about so not a bit of debris from the plants.  ::)
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Sue on October 13, 2017, 09:14:40 PM
Yes, test again in 2 days.
If ammonia is zero but nitrite is not zero, wait another 2 days and test again.
But if both ammonia and nitrite are zero, add another 2 ppm ammonia and test next day.

This is not what I wrote in the 'how to' thread, but it is because you have a lot of plants so the cycle won't be the same as without plants.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on October 13, 2017, 09:35:37 PM
Thanks, Sue I had realized it was a bit different that is why I am posting it in this way then I will print the whole thing off at the end so I have it to refer back to. Thank You for all your help it is really appreciated. I will put some food in tomorrow and see how it goes. B xx
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on October 16, 2017, 05:37:35 PM
[FCMF DELETING LARGE SECTION THAT WAS A COPY & PASTE OF THREAD REPLIES #50 & #51 AND THUS POTENTIALLY CONFUSING. C:-)]

CONTINUATION OF WATER QUALITY RESULTS FROM REPLY #51:  C:-)

Fed snails a piece of lettuce not sure if they ate any, but I definitely have baby snails more showing each day.
today's test
16/10/17

PH: 7.4
Ammonia: 0.25
Nitrate: 10
Nitrite: 0

do I wait another 2 days and test again?
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Sue on October 16, 2017, 06:58:38 PM
Yes I would wait and test again. The good news is that you don't have any nitrite, but you need to make sure the plants can remove all the ammonia before getting fish.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on October 16, 2017, 07:17:47 PM
But what about the Nitrate it just seems to be getting higher and higher is that not dangerous. I really do not understand about them. I need to re-read it so I can try and get the gist of it all.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Sue on October 16, 2017, 07:37:07 PM
Ooohhh, I missed that  :-[

Yes it does seem a bit odd.

Did you use a bacterial starter at any stage, either when you overdosed ammonia or when you started again? And if so, what was it?
Did the plants come out of a tank that had fish in, or was it a plant-only tank?

1 ppm ammonia is turned into 2.7 ppm nitrite, which is then turned into 3.6 ppm nitrate. Since your tap nitrate is zero, that 10 ppm must all have come from ammonia, and 2.8 ppm ammonia is turned into 10 ppm nitrate.


So....
if you did use a bacterial starter, it could be that it contained nitrite eating bacteria
or
if the plants came from a tank that also had fish, there would have been bacteria on the plants.



Nitrate is only a problem at higher levels, though there is now evidence that we should keep our tanks below 20 ppm nitrate. You don't have fish yet so I wouldn't worry about nitrate. The main thing is that your tank (be it bacteria or plants) can remove all the ammonia made by your future fish, and any nitrite that may be made from that ammonia.
This is why I am concentrating on making sure that your plants are well growing and can take up all the ammonia that you add, or that you grow enough bacteria to eat any ammonia that the plants can't deal with.

A thought has just occurred to  me - are you using any nitrate containing plant fertiliser?
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on October 16, 2017, 07:56:17 PM
When I first set the tank up I overdid the ammonia, after a few days use some put Tetra Safe Start Water Conditioner, 50 ml into the water, but since then have done a 90% water change and not added any more, my plants were from a plant only tank from a shop, I added some amazon swords from Andy earlier in the week I think they were from a tank with fish but it was going up before I added them.
 
The Plant food is " Love Fish Plant Food is nitrate and phosphate free so avoids encouraging unwanted algae."
I have only added 20 ml of this over that last 2 weeks as it is a weekly feed.

My Plants are growing I can see new growth on all and the grass that died off is sprouting in some places as well so all seems good for them.

I do still have the fine sponge in the filter alongside the carbon one should I maybe take that out now.?
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Sue on October 16, 2017, 07:59:57 PM
If you remove anything I would remove the carbon  :)

In that case I would just wait until the tank can get rid of all the ammonia. Once the plants are growing really well, it shouldn't take too long. And just ignore the nitrate for now. Once you do have fish, you can test nitrate then to make sure it doesn't go over 20 ppm.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Matt on October 16, 2017, 10:08:47 PM
The carbon will be removing the fertiliser and getting clogged by it so I would agree on removing it
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on October 18, 2017, 05:27:05 PM
So what should I put in place of it. ?

Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Sue on October 18, 2017, 07:07:47 PM
What is the carbon? It could be a bag of granules, a carbon impregnated sponge or a cartridge (a flat bag of carbon held on a plastic frame). What to replace it with depends on what shape it is.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on October 18, 2017, 08:41:37 PM
It is a carbon impregnated sponge you can have a look at the filter here.

http://www.interpet.co.uk/Media/InterpetUK/Skoo/2201/2201_7.pdf
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Sue on October 18, 2017, 09:09:57 PM
In that case, all you need is another piece of sponge, any brand, and cut it to the same size and shape as the carbon sponge. I would look for a cheap filter sponge so that it will be the right type of sponge. A bath sponge isn't, for example. (Some sponges are designed to hold water, others to allow water to run through them. Obviously filter sponges need to be the kind that let water run trough  ;D )
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on October 19, 2017, 01:51:18 PM
I have ordered some thanks,  we have just had a card from Northumbrian Water they are going to be cleaning the pipes between the 26th oct-1st nov  I am hoping this is not going to cause any problems after all the work I have put into getting the tank right.   ::)
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Sue on October 19, 2017, 03:42:59 PM
I have't had problems when they've done that because I do a bigger than usual water change the day before the first date on the card and the next one at least 2 days after the second date. That way anything in the pipes has had chance to be flushed out before I put any water in my tanks.
It is annoying though when you get a second card saying they couldn't do it the first time so they'll be doing it instead on these new dates.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on October 19, 2017, 05:11:21 PM
I was thinking that might be worth doing but as not finished cycling yet might not have fish by then anyway so will be lucky. I forgot to do reading today and it is getting too dark to get good readings now so will do it in the morning. fingers crossed it is ok. B xx
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on October 20, 2017, 09:23:31 PM
Ok so The tests today are.
PH: 7.4 ish,
Ammonia: 0
Nitrate: 20-30
Nitrite: 0

I was worried about the Nitrate so took a sample to A.M. Aquatics on the team valley Gateshead they tested my water and it is ready to go. I showed him all my reading he did a test with their testing equipment and all was spot on with my readings. I bought 2 Assasin snails as I am getting loads of Malaysian snails after a bit chat with him, he suggested that my tank will get overrun with them and would be better with Assasins as they do not breed as much and will be just as good for the tank. Tomorrow I am picking up my first fish  Yippee.... :fishy1: :fishy1: :fishy1: :fishy1: :fishy1:
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Sue on October 20, 2017, 10:15:41 PM
Take it slowly with the fish, not too many to start with. And test every day till you are sure that ammonia and nitrite stay at zero. This is the only problem about cycling with plants, the cycle runs differently  ;D
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on October 20, 2017, 11:01:32 PM
I am getting some neons as he says they would be fine, and happy to test everyday fingers crossed. Thank You to everyone that has helped me out I am very happy it has finally worked. Bxxxx :cheers:
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Sue on October 21, 2017, 09:01:43 AM
Barbara, if you read this before you go out - neons should be OK.

But........
Don't believe anything a fish shop tells you - first rule of fish keeping. Yes there are some good ones but they are very few and far between so it is safer to assume they are all talking rubbish. The problem we have at the moment is that there still seems to be something wrong with Seriously Fish so we can't check on there - their profile pages are blank.
For example, very very few shop owners/workers know anything about cycling. Most of them don't know what the word means.

With plants in the tank you can't use enough ammonia to cycle for a tank full of fish so you need to take things slowly so that the plants can use all the ammonia made by the fish. As the plants get bigger they'll be able to use more ammonia, so then you can get more fish.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Littlefish on October 21, 2017, 10:00:44 AM
@Aquarius Barbara new fish day is very exciting. Please post pics when your fish have settled.  ;D

@Sue I'm glad that you mentioned problems with the SF site as I was wondering where all the information was and thought it was a problem with my computer.  ::)

As for information and advice given at fish stores, it can be very variable. I've only been enjoying the wonderful world of fish for a couple of years, and have spent a lot of time at various stores talking to the staff and listening to them talk to other customers. I have checked information given with that available on various sites, and also here, and am now generally comfortable with who to listen to at the shops. I have even met a member of staff at a branch of Pets@Home who gave me a faily detailed grilling about my tank and quarantine tank when I wanted to buy some otocinclus (there were none in stock at the stores I'd usually go to). This lady was very firm about the requirement for fishless cycling, and also only adding otos to mature tanks. I was quite pleased with what I witnessed, so perhaps some P@H are more reliable than others.
Last weekend I was at a local MA and saw them testing the water sample that a customer had brought , as she'd had a problem with her fishless cycle. After testing the sample and talking to the customer they found that she'd rinsed the filter media in tap water. They explained the problem to her, told her what to do, and refused to sell her any fish, telling her to return with another sample when the cycle was back on track.
Yesterday I was at an independant LFS to pick up some live food, and was chatting with a member of staff who I trust. He'd gone to the George V Joe aquascaping competition recently, and had taken a detour or more than 20 miles to visit another store. He said that he was very disappointed to see that they were selling tank buster fish, and that the tanks didn't seem to have enough decor/hides for the fish they contained, both things that he obviously felt quite strongly about.
There is a lot of conflicting information available everywhere, which can be very confusing. I feel that sites like this one are absolutely invaluable for the years of experience available, and the friendly atmosphere that encourages people to ask questions. Sometimes it's a case of finding out as much information as possible, discussing the information with trusted sources, trying our best to get things right, and keeping a close eye on all of the aquatic friends under our care.
 :)
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Sue on October 21, 2017, 10:09:27 AM
There are some good fish store workers, the problem is working out which ones they are.

Like the chap at MA when I bought my betta. He keeps discus but said that it was OK to keep plakat bettas in community tanks, just not long tailed bettas. He may know discus but he obviously doesn't know bettas.

But in my favourite shop I came in half way through a conversation with another customer - no I'm afraid you can't keep those fish with the ones you already have ....... no you can't keep those either.......well what would you suggest?.....how about these, or these or these......

Customers can be as bad. In one shop I overheard - I bought these fish a few weeks ago, they were this big Now they're this big, what are you going to do about it! She was talking about bleeding heart tetras which she bought at half an inch long and were now 2 inches long


Regarding SF, I even turned on my Kindle Fire to check it wasn't a problem with my laptop  ;D
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on October 21, 2017, 10:47:23 AM
This is all making me very worried the guy at the shop really seemed to know what he was talking about, I also had the same conversation with the gut at Fish Alive in Durham and he told me the same, I am going to go ahead and get the fish today and just see how it goes. Thanks for all your comments. Bx
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Sue on October 21, 2017, 12:01:11 PM
The thing that has me worried is that you haven't said that you added another dose of ammonia and that cleared to zero ammonia and zero nitrite in 24 hours. But as I have said before, with plants things are different. Provided you don't stock the tank to the max in one go, you should be fine.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on October 21, 2017, 04:28:05 PM
Yes I did and it cleared that is why I had it checked. Just putting in my fish now 6 neon tetras and 6 harlequins. Fingers crossed.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Sue on October 21, 2017, 04:36:57 PM
That sounds a nice combination of fish  :)


Just a warning that it is not unknown for the odd one or two shoaling fish to die shortly after purchase. Considering what they have been through it's not surprising. They've been shipped from the breeding farms to a UK wholesaler, then to the shop where they've been gawked at and chased round with a net every time anyone bought fish from that tank, then caught and put in a bag before arriving at your tank. All stressful for the poor things.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: fcmf on October 21, 2017, 05:05:43 PM
Yes I did and it cleared that is why I had it checked.
Relieved to read of this. I had been reading this thread with the same concerns as Sue but unfortunately haven't been in a position to reply until today.

This is all making me very worried the guy at the shop really seemed to know what he was talking about
This is a common issue in LFSs - they sound but aren't necessarily very knowledgeable, particularly around fishless cycles. There is still a widespread view out there by prospective fishkeepers and LFSs alike that a fishless cycle involves just having the filter switched on for a/several week(s) in a fishless tank and that readings of 0 ammonia/nitrite and <20 nitrates means that the tank is fish-ready, whereas the filter actually needs to go through the preparation phase so that it can process the fish waste/ammonia. On the issue of sounding authoritative, that's part of their role - I overheard a conversation in a LFS involving a customer wanting "one pink coloured tetra, one blue coloured tetra...", etc, until I was able to breathe a sigh of relief when she was correctly advised to purchase them in shoals as they were shoaling fish, only for the next sentence to cause me to audibly wince as the authoritative voice said "...shoals of at least two...".. It takes time to learn - on here - what is correct/incorrect advice and therefore whether the authoritative-sounding voice is actually imparting correct information or what they think the customer wants to hear / is likely to get a sale / may get sales further down the line (of medication / replacement fish).

Just putting in my fish now 6 neon tetras and 6 harlequins.
I approve highly of your choice of fish. :D :cheers: Best of luck with them.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Littlefish on October 21, 2017, 07:54:21 PM
I hope that your new fish love their new home and settle in quickly.  :cheers:
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on October 21, 2017, 09:07:57 PM
Well, they seem happy enough they have had their supper and having a good look around.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Sue on October 21, 2017, 09:17:44 PM
Looking good  :)



Can I make a suggestion? Get some floating plants  :) Even demolishing a plastic plant with large flat leaves and placing them on the surface would help.
I have Espei's rasboras which are closely related to harlequins. My Espei's rasboras do not like swimming under an exposed surface. Until I got some floating plants, they spent all their time huddled in a corner. They still won't come out from under the floating plants even to eat - luckily the plants now cover 3/4 of the water surface.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Littlefish on October 21, 2017, 09:39:40 PM
Great stuff.  :cheers:
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on October 21, 2017, 10:02:05 PM
As It is a small tank and I do not want to get overrun with plants I am going to see if some rubber matting laid over the top of the lid will diffuse the light a bit.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Sue on October 21, 2017, 10:10:38 PM
It doesn't have to be live plants. Something this could work, if you could find anything like it - I once saw a tank that had a silk plant attached to the upper part of the back of the tank with a sucker. The plants had long thin leaves and they were allowed to float on the surface.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on October 23, 2017, 12:24:11 AM
The Harlequins were a bit odd today but I covered part of the Lid with some matting so the light was more mottled and subdued and they are as happy as larry now. It is a rather strong light for such a small tank but glad it's sorted now

I tested the water and there is no change so all's good today.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Matt on October 23, 2017, 07:04:43 AM
Can you raise the light up a bit as well? This will result in less light reaching the tank...
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on October 23, 2017, 01:22:27 PM
It can't go up much but I have turned it away a bit so its more at the back than full on the top.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Sue on October 23, 2017, 02:01:43 PM
If you could find some aquarium safe plastic floating plants, they would help too. As long as the light didn't melt them.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on October 25, 2017, 02:54:20 PM
Hi sorry I have not been about bit of a hectic week.

The fish are still doing ok my daily water reading stayed the same for 3 days then the nitrated dropped a bit but then ph, ammonia and nitrates spiked so I did a 20% water change yesterday fish still happy but will test shortly and see how it is today.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Sue on October 25, 2017, 03:11:16 PM
That's the way to go, daily testing and water changes as necessary (ie whenever you see either ammonia and/or nitrite above zero). Once they both stay at zero you can go longer between tests - until you get more fish, then start testing daily again.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on October 26, 2017, 12:52:49 AM
Today's test was back to the same as the day I put the fish in the tank, it was only a small spike but did it so would not get worse. we will see what tomorrows test is like I have been doing the test at 4 pm each day but I will be out tomorrow at that time so will either do it earlier or in the evening. Getting into a routine with the tank is helping me to make sure I don't forget things, on the next water change I will remove the carbon and replace with plain filter sponge.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Sue on October 26, 2017, 09:25:33 AM
When you replace the carbon it is possible (but not certain) you'll have another spike as you will remove some bacteria. If you do, it won't last long and just do extra water changes.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on October 28, 2017, 11:42:18 PM
Water testing still going well, added two Honey Gourami's yesterday and they seem happy enough.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Sue on October 29, 2017, 07:50:46 AM
Oooh, which colour gouramis did you get? They come in natural, yellow and red. (The natural form has a tan male and beige female).
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Littlefish on October 29, 2017, 09:24:08 AM
Lovely.  :)
Please post pics when you have time.
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on October 30, 2017, 10:14:42 AM
Yesterdays reading

PH: 7.6
AM: 0.25-0.50
N/Ri: 0
N/Ra: 20+

They are a red/orange a male and a female, we had our grandchildren with us, they insisted we name them so they chose the names, James & Michelle, all seem happy enough,  small spike again yesterday so did a 30% water change and replaced the carbon filter for a plain one. will test again tonight


Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Matt on November 01, 2017, 06:57:04 PM
Pictures please  :isay:

I am considering seeing if I can get honey gourami to get on with my rams as whilst Im a massive ram fan, I do miss the characters of the gouramis.  I've heard some mixed experiences with this however...

Will yours 'wave' at you with their feelers if you wiggle your finger up and down on the glass??
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on November 09, 2017, 11:32:36 AM
Hi Matt,
 I never tried waving at them, I know they are tearing my plants to bits they seem to love the floating plants Andy kindly sent me. I have been away for a few days and a friend looked after them for me they are all happily getting along together. I will take some pictures later on for you if I can get them to stay still long enough. LOl. Bx
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on November 09, 2017, 07:25:24 PM
Here are a few pictures, not the best but hopefully you can see them ok. Bx
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Littlefish on November 09, 2017, 07:40:47 PM
 :cheers:

Did you try waving at them? Dd they wave back?  ;D
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on November 09, 2017, 08:25:41 PM
Yes and not sure suppose if they move their feelers it could be that they are waving. Lol
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Sue on November 09, 2017, 08:31:23 PM
That's what most people call waving with gouramis. The feelers are actually modified pelvic fins and they use them to investigate their surroundings. So if they see something such as a human peering through the glass, they'll try to find out what this thing is, and don't realise about glass being in the way  :)
Title: Re: IT'S DONE YAY
Post by: Aquarius Barbara on November 09, 2017, 08:48:40 PM
ha, ha I suppose they did then, My assassin snails ganged up on a Malaysian snail But I am going to have to teach them manners as they did it right at the front in full view of everyone, they are going to have to learn to be a bit more discreet and do it behind some rocks etc so I don't have to watch the carnage again.  :'(