Tropical Fish Forum
Tropical Fish Keeping => General Fishkeeping Chat => Topic started by: fishtales on November 26, 2019, 04:55:46 PM
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have ordered some clown loach (https://www.thinkfish.co.uk/fish/clown-loach.html). I researched lots of suppliers before choosing them.
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The water parameters of the bag will tell you how long you need to mix them for. Apart from that just leave them dark and disturb them as little as possible. Once in the tank, feed them if they're hungry...
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This is very exciting. I hope everything goes well on Thursday. :)
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I am so nervous. I will fill the 125lt tank tomorrow, getting it set up with heaters. I will wait till Thursday morning and put the Fluval 206 on the tank, this has been running on the big tank with some mature media out of the other filters in anticipation of setting the quarantine up for my clowns.
Hi @fishtales
What size is your "big tank"? Is the "big tank" going to be used to house the Clown Loaches?
JPC
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I'm personally a fan of the "plop and drop methodology. Believing that fish are most at risk of ammonia poisoning from being kept in a filterless bag or bucket than they are at risk of temperature shock and thay they need longer than e.g. 30 mins to adapt to a different water chemistry (likely many days). This method simply advises you to temperature acclimate if in a sealed bag (bag must remain sealed as ammonia is less toxic when bag sealed as pH lower due to build up on co2) and then pour the fish out of the bag through a net (so you catch the fish - plop) then drop them straight into your tank.
Sorry, not sure than helps give you clarity on what approach to take... but it's a method I've used with great success personally.
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I am so nervous. I will fill the 125lt tank tomorrow, getting it set up with heaters. I will wait till Thursday morning and put the Fluval 206 on the tank, this has been running on the big tank with some mature media out of the other filters in anticipation of setting the quarantine up for my clowns.
Hi @fishtales
What size is your "big tank"? Is the "big tank" going to be used to house the Clown Loaches?
JPC
Hi @jaypeecee. The big tank is 5ft 400lt. Yes the clowns will be going to the 5ft tank after quarantine. As I mentioned in my intro thread. I realise I will be looking at an even bigger tank in the future :)
Hi @fishtales
OK, now I'm up to speed. Sorry but I'd overlooked your intro thread. A friend of mine has a 7ft 500 litre tank so I have an idea of the scale of your setup. You're obviously drawn to big fish. Will be interested to hear how things progress.
JPC
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Well I certainly wouldn't say I am drawn to big fish @jaypeecee . In fact having a big fish ruined my pleasure in keeping fish at the beginning. But after my experience with my Sailfin pleco, I am very aware of what it is like for a large fish to be stuck in a tiny aquarium. With insufficient flitration and maintenance. Truth be told I wish big fish weren't so easily available for fish keepers to buy. I personally think Sailfins, Clowns, pacu, common goldfish, all common plecs etc should have to be ordered in for the select few who have tanks (or ponds) big enough to accomodate them. Or better still some of them shouldn't be available full stop.
That sadly isn't the case, and while my set up isn't perfect for the fish I am getting permanantly, They will be in a bigger aquarium with a larger group. I believe this will improve their mental well being as well as there physical. Equally important IMO.
Hi @fishtales
Good on ya! Are you aware of INJAF? Stands for 'It's Not Just A Fish'. I would have provided a link here to their site but it's not a secured site yet.
JPC
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Hi @fishtales
I'd forgotten how much good stuff there is on that site. The 'Effects of Malnutrition on Fish' is very interesting as is the section on 'Hormones & Pheromones'. I was having a discussion with one of my fish-breeding buddies recently. He is a hands-on, non-scientific, expert breeder of (pretty much) all fish types - particularly livebearers. From his practical experience, he had drawn the conclusion that pheromones played a big part in the rate of growth and the maximum size attained. And, this is particularly important to breeders. As I understand it, it's the female fish that releases pheromones, which then attract the males.
JPC
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Great news, and I'm looking forward to seeing some pics. :)
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I suspect you can make a temperature change such as that (2 degrees) instantly without any bother though do oevr 2 days for comfort factor if you wish. Why not split the difference and go for 15 degrees in both. You can lower if in the main tank afterwards if required. 26 or right at the top of the range for black widow tetra and the loaches.
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So I have my Clown loach in quarantine at a temp of 26C. At the moment my main tank runs at 24C. The main tank has Sailfin pleco, Rainbow Shark, Corydoras Aeneus and Black widow tetra. Should I gradually increase the temp in main tank to 26C? I read 26.1C is the maximum my Sailfin should be kept at. However looking at other sources they consider a higher temperature acceptable for him.
Hi @fishtales
I cannot advise on the optimum temperature for your Clown Loach. But, please take a look at the following thread:
https://forums.thinkfish.co.uk/fish-tanks-and-equipment/aquarium-thermometer-accuracy/
It is not possible to overstress the inaccuracy of many electronic digital aquarium thermometers. We put our full trust in them but many are not deserving of this trust. It is not uncommon to find these thermometers being +/-2C incorrect out of the box. So, for a nominal reading of 24.0C, this could be anywhere from 22.0C to 26.0C. And this accuracy can get even worse as the battery ages. These digital aquarium thermometers are 'dirt' cheap for a reason! It is false economy.
JPC
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Glad to hear you have ordered the type that go inside the tank as those stick on the outside ones are not nearly as accurate :)
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Hmmm - when I kept cories, I noticed what you are describing, but you may well have identified the original source of the problem in your case. Personally, I'd be more inclined to treat for bacterial infection such as eSHa 2000 or Waterlife Myxazin.
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It would probably be worth doing a water change and running some carbon through the filter (if you have some?) for 24 hours to help dilute the Paraguard before starting a new treatment.
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I have got the thermometers ordered.
Hi @fishtales
Which thermometer did you decide on (manufacturer/model number)? Obviously, the required temperature accuracy depends on a variety of things. Off the top of my head:
[1] Species of fish being kept.
[2] Community or species tank
[3] During cycling/cycled tank.
[4] Breeding/not breeding.
With an established, healthy aquarium, an accuracy of +/-1C is probably adequate. But, I like to aim for +/- 0.5C. Using my +/-0.2C catering thermometer, I have checked all my other, cheaper aquarium thermometers. So, each now carries a label alongside it saying 'reads 1.9C high', for example. Obviously, if the thermometer is of the electronic variety, the one decimal point resolution is very desirable - particularly when used in a large tank where it can take a long time for the water temperature to change due to its high thermal mass.
JPC
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I have got the thermometers ordered.
Hi @fishtales
Which thermometer did you decide on (manufacturer/model number)? Obviously, the required temperature accuracy depends on a variety of things. Off the top of my head:
[1] Species of fish being kept.
[2] Community or species tank
[3] During cycling/cycled tank.
[4] Breeding/not breeding.
With an established, healthy aquarium, an accuracy of +/-1C is probably adequate. But, I like to aim for +/- 0.5C. Using my +/-0.2C catering thermometer, I have checked all my other, cheaper aquarium thermometers. So, each now carries a label alongside it saying 'reads 1.9C high', for example. Obviously, if the thermometer is of the electronic variety, the one decimal point resolution is very desirable - particularly when used in a large tank where it can take a long time for the water temperature to change due to its high thermal mass.
JPC
Oh dear. This really is a minefield! I have ordered two of these SuperAqua (https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B0138GNMMA/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1)
Could you point me in the right direction on what I should buy if these aren't accurate enough please @jaypeecee
ETA I would like as an accurate reading as possible. I know I may not need it for the fish, but for my own sanity I feel I require a reliable reading. I like to know all my tanks parameters including what temperature they are really running at.
Hi @fishtales
If you follow the links that I provided, you will end up on a site called FishLab. And if you scroll to almost exactly half way down that long page, you will see "Best submersible thermometer: JW Smarttemp". I thought you would have chosen that one.
BTW, what does 'ETA' stand for? I equate this with 'Estimated Time of Arrival' but, in this context, that wouldn't make sense - or does it?
JPC
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Hi @fishtales
As I mentioned previously, one option is to continue using your existing thermometers - electronic or otherwise. Then, calibrate them against a specified accuracy 'reference' thermometer. One possible option is the following, which is specified as +/-0.5C from -10C to +100C:
https://thermometer.co.uk/food-thermometers/1320-thermastick-pocket-thermometers.html
I'm beginning to wish that I'd never brought this topic up. I was only trying to help draw your attention to this.
But, we need not panic. Let's arrive at a solution that meets your needs tomorrow. Please forgive me but my brain needs a break.
JPC
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Good Morning, @fishtales
I have a Hanna HI 98501 and it gets a lot of use.
JPC
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BTW, what does 'ETA' stand for? I equate this with 'Estimated Time of Arrival' but, in this context, that wouldn't make sense - or does it?
If any consolation, I also only knew of 'estimated time of arrival'. Often, I check out urbandictionary.com to find out possibilities for the latest acronym I encounter. ;)
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What sand is it? Just wondering if it is too sharp for the cories? Play sand vs sharp sand - you should go play sand for example.
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Given the price of play sand it might be worth swapping it out for peace of mind... bith from a bacterial and a sharpness point of view. How are the cories barbells?
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So sorry to hear that one of your clown loaches has passed. :(
I'm not sure that I would treat with medication unless there is a sign of disease, but I don't have any experience withe clown loaches specifically, so perhaps one of the others would be able to offer better advice.
As for pecking order disputes contributing to the death of your clown, I guess it would depend on how rough the fighting is. With my fish I would say yes in the case of the tiger barbs, but no with regards to the panda garras, which bicker rather than fight.
Sorry I can't be of more help at the moment.
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Very sorry to read about this. I've had no personal experience with clown loaches so unfortunately can't comment on their behaviour. However, all species are certainly capable of fighting (and this may include to the point of a fatal injury or stress-induced death), and indeed my male x-ray tetras have acquired a lot of injuries over the years through their frequent spats (eg their longstanding eye injuries, marks on their spine which do heal), and rogue individuals exist even in the most timid and peaceful of species.
I agree that there is no need to do a treatment. If there were a sign of finrot, fungus or other infection pre-death (some of these can occur post-mortem), then yes. However, for parasites, eSHa 2000 wouldn't be the treatment of choice. Also, without anything to pinpoint what was wrong and therefore which treatment would be required, treatment is rather pointless and more likely to cause undue stress and further problems if not actually required. Additionally, unless you had a hospital tank to move the fish too, you'd be risking disrupting the cycle in the quarantine tank - a risk that is far greater than the very small (if any) benefit of treatment in this case.
Hope that helps.
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Internal parasites:
Round worms such as camallanus worms - eSHa-ndx
Flat worms such as tapeworms - eSHa gdex
Protozoan - the most effective treatment is metronidazole which is prescription only in the UK.
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Best of luck with your clowns.
Sometimes the little smaller ones of any species can be quite feisty (I'm 4ft 11 :rotfl: )
I went for a drive around a few LFS in my new area on the weekend. One had a display tank that included a group of clown loaches. I have to say that they were big fish, with one being particularly huge. They had such stunning colours & markings. Very impressive. 8)
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There's a lot to be said for RO. Some of my tanks are a mix of RO/tap due to the hardness of the tap water. I get my RO from the LFS, but struggle to shift it from the boot of the car into the house, and can often be heard mumbling expletives under my breath. :o
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I often get water ready the night before because I run the water through a nitrate filter, which slows the whole process. I also have several large tanks, so am getting back into the routine of doing one a night during the week, so I don't have to do them all on the weekend.
If I wasn't renting I think I'd look at getting an RO unit, so I'll be interested to hear what sort of units you look at.
It's amazing that so much information is picked up without realising when you start learning about fish, water parameters, nitrogen cycle, etc. Learning anything new is always an exciting challenge. :)
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There's a lot to be said for RO.
Hi @Littlefish
Yes, using remineralized RO is what I've been doing for about ten years. I prefer doing this because I then know what's in the water. If anyone decides to go for this option, I can advise on remineralizing products/DIY. Also, the additional option of RO/DI water. But, you are correct, Littlefish, in saying that lugging the stuff around is not something that should be taken lightly (pun intended).
JPC
EDIT: I used to have my own RO unit but the throughput was far too low. And, if you're on a water meter as I am now, it could prove expensive as the process of producing RO water is not particularly efficient. I can't remember the exact figure but it has to be taken into account.
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It's amazing that so much information is picked up without realising when you start learning about fish, water parameters, nitrogen cycle, etc. Learning anything new is always an exciting challenge. :)
Hi @Littlefish
And that last sentence says it all for me. The day that I stop learning about things that interest me is not something that I can envisage happening. Long may it stay like that!
JPC :isay:
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[Some posts missing in this thread as, regrettably for us given that she was a valued member, former member Fishtales left the forum and deleted most of her posts and edited the initial post.]