Filter Flow Rate

I have the API testers, they use whole NO2 and 3. The nitrite scale has colours for 0, 0.25, 0.5, 1.0, 2.0 and 5.0. This makes it quite easy to see when to do a water change. Nitrate had bigger steps - 0, 5, 10, 20, 40, 80 and 100.

Nitrate isn't nearly as important, but the lower the better and if the tap water nitrate is low it means you can keep the tank nitrate nice and low as well. My tap water nitrate is between the 0 and 5 colours (whole NO3 scale). In some areas it is around 40.
Your tank nitrate should be pretty close to your tap nitrate with having to do lots of water changes. Once you are cycled, the guideline for telling if your water changes are big enough is keep the nitrate from ever getting to tap water level plus 20 on the whole NO3 scale; with the N scale that would be tap plus 4.5.

As you know I'm cycling with far too many fish in. I started the process around the 16th Feb. Since 22nd Feb I've consistently had zero ammonia. PH has remained around 7.5. But the nitrite levels rise rapidly 24 hours after a water change (Seachem wearing off as well), so I presume that I've still a fair way to go?

I downloaded a summary water quality report from my water company for my town (Wessex Water). They do over 40 tests and nitrate came in as minimum 30.71 mg/l to maximum 38.81 mg/l. When I've tested the tank water it's been between 11-22 mg/l. I know Sue has mentioned it's difficult to get accurate results from home test kits for nitrate, but I'm not even at the base level for the water company. I tested today and it's possibly 22 mg/l or a bit lower. Any ideas as to why it would be so out or is the test just inaccurate? I'm using the NT Labs Aquarium Lab and you add a nitrate reagent and a nitrate disc and wait 10 minutes and check the colour against a chart.

The bit in bold, did you mean nitrite or nitrate?

Your tank nitrate - is that figure converted for whole nitrate - you mentioned a few posts ago that your test kit measures only the N part not the whole thing. Water companies use the whole-thing scale.

What does your tap water nitrate come out at with your tester? If it's the same as the tank, there is obviously a discrepancy between your tester and the water company's results. But if the tap water is the same as the water company, and higher than the tank, something in the tank is causing it to fall.

The process is:
ammonia is made by the fish as a waste product. Bacteria in the filter and on other surfaces use this ammonia as food, and their waste product is nitrite. A second species of bacteria lives in the filter and on other surfaces which uses nitrite as food, and their waste product is nitrate. So all the ammonia made by the fish as their equivalent of urine ends up as nitrate - once there enough ammonia-eating and nitrite-eating bacteria in the tank.

Since your tap water reading is different from the water company's values, put it down to our test kits not being the most accurate. It is difficult to make a really accurate nitrate tester for use in the home.
Instead, use your readings for both tap and tank nitrates. Unless a tank is heavily planted (plants use nitrate as fertiliser), the lowest a tank nitrate can be is the amount of nitrate in the tap water used to fill the tank.
When a tank is cycled it is usual to do weekly water changes to remove nitrate and other substances secreted by the fish that we can't measure. During the time between water changes the nitrate level of the tank gradually creeps up as the ammonia continually being excreted by the fish gets turned into nitrate. If there aren't enough bacteria of one or both species to make nitrate it stays constant; and if the fishkeeper is having to do daily water changes to keep ammonia and/or nitrite at safe levels, nitrate won't go up much.

The best way to use nitrate results is to follow a trend in the tank. Once your need for water changes slows down so you can go longer between them you should find the tank nitrate increasing, though the rise might be too small to measure accurately. It's once the nitrite slows down that you should start to see nitrate rising.

As for unsafe nitrate levels, it depends on who you read.
There are some species of fish that are intolerant of nitrate but reading up on fish before you buy should tell if if the fish you want are one of those species.
Some sources say that nitrate is only harmful in the hundreds ('whole-nitrate' scale) while others are now saying anything over 20 is not good.
But as a rule of thumb, once a tank is cycled, the fishkeeper should aim to keep the nitrate level from exceeding tap level plus 20, 'whole nitrate' scale. If it gets higher than that he has too many fish or he is feeding them too much (food decomposes to make ammonia which is converted to nitrate) or the water changes aren't often enough or they aren't big enough. Or a combination of those.



It's only really necessary to test the pH of water that has been left to stand. The others change hardly at all, if any at all. pH is different because water companies tend to add things to the water supply. In hard water areas they might add carbon dioxide to the water to acidify to try and prevent limescale deposits in the water mains. On standing, the carbon dioxide gasses of and the pH changes. In soft water areas they may add chemicals to increase the pH to prevent corrosion of any metal parts in the system.
Since the water in the tank has been standing a while, it is useful to know if your tapwater does change on standing, and if it does, by how much.

I'm not sure it is possible to have too many plants 

Provided there is room for the fish to swim and you bear in mind the needs for fertilisers of various types, the tank will be fine.

Don't ask me about fertilisers, ask someone who knows what they are doing 



edit - I should also have said that plants use ammonia as fertiliser as well as nitrate, so plants that are growing well can also help with a fish-in cycle.

Quote from: Sue on March 18, 2016, 09:10:09 PM

I'm not sure it is possible to have too many plants 

I totally agree. 

Not only does lush planting look great, but the fish love it

Yes it does. I've admired the photos you have posted Extreme_One and thanks for the flow chart thingy .

I was more worried about them upsetting the cycling process but from what you've said Sue I have nothing to be concerned about. Thanks 

On a separate issue, I want to get some nerite snails, but was advised to wait until the tank is fully matured. When the tank has cycled would 5 nerite snails upset the bio-load of my tank?

Thanks Sue. I'll (hopefully) get some soon. Well the plants are growing as is the algae, but there still seems to be some unhealthy looking leaves.

I appreciated the flow chart Extreme_One. I'm still finding it difficult to be certain what the deficiencies are. So I see from another of your posts you recommended Easycarbo & Profito, so I've bought 500 ml bottles of each for £15.95. I'll let you know how that goes.

Back to my in-fish cycling. The light is at the end of the tunnel  . Ammonia has been zero now for a month and now nitrite has been zero for 6 days  . I've just had to do the second dose of a re-occurrence of white spot. So I'm going to dose again at 7 days this time.

So it seems the tank is nearly cycled, six weeks after being badly advised at LFS. This had made caring for the fish very stressful and if it wasn't for encouragement and excellent knowledge from you people out there I'm sure some, if not all my fish would now be dead. Instead I have 18, seemingly, very happy little fish

Just one more day of zero nitrite and you will officially be cycled  Well done for seeing it through without casualties.



Whitespot can come back if just one bug isn't killed. I once had to do three courses of treatment one after the other 

If I'm reading it right, you have only planted the tank up recently. You'd expect the plants to lose some leaves at first, it takes a while for them to get going. That's a more likely explanation than a deficiency. The first virtue in setting up a tank is patience in every regard.

You need to wait at least a couple of months for your plants to establish before you conclude they need fertiliser. You may just encourage algae if you add ferts when the plants aren't growing strongly. Most "aquatic" plants are in fact marsh plants and are grown for sale with their roots in water but the tops out. They grow much faster this way as they are not limited by carbon dioxide, there's always enough in the air. It's a shock to them when we then plant them submerged and it takes a while for them to adjust.
The other question concerns your substrate (I can't remember if you mentioned it). If it's just an inch or two of gravel, especially if it's coarse, you will find it much more difficult to grow decent plants than if you use some additive (soil, compost or special plant substrate) to make it more suitable.