Will Partial WC Increase KH?

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Offline Digs1923

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Will partial WC increase KH?
« on: June 19, 2014, 06:02:42 PM »
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Hi, hope it's okay to start a new topic to get the answer to this question...

The good news is I think my tank has finally cycled - yay   :D :D
Over a period of about 10 days, ammonia readings have been 0, nitrites have appeared and for the last three days I have had a nitrate reading.  Day 1 was probably between 0 and 5, yesterday was 5 and today is quite orange and I would say possibly 10.  My pH has remained stable at 7.4 for several days.  No remineralisation salts have been added since 7th June.  HOWEVER, my KH has been steadily dropping (WC on 7th June, 9th June and 15th June and will probably do one tonight as I'm going away until Sunday).  My KH reading this evening is 2.8.

Am I correct in thinking that if I add more remineralisation salts it will cause my pH to rise as when they were first added it went as high as 8.0.  I know quick changes in pH are stressful for the fish and obviously I don't want it to be at 8.0 anyway.  It's stayed at 7.4 for over a week now.

But do I need to increase the KH?  Other than adding remineralisation salts, will doing a partial WC help?  Now the tank has cycled and pH is stable (for now!) does it matter that the KH is low?

Just to be sure my tank HAS cycled, I won't be adding any more fish until next weekend (I'd like to pretend it's because I'm being sensible, but the truth is because I'm away this weekend, I won't get chance to go to LFS until then  ;D  )

In the meantime I'll keep testing and wait for advice on whether to mess with the KH again (chemically I mean - not by WC).

Thanks for your help!

Liz

A Selection of Fish in my Fish Community Creator Tanks
Black Widow Tetra (4) - Glowlight Tetra (7) - Cardinal Tetra (7) -
Note: The user may not necessarily own these fish, these are tanks that they may be building or researching for stocking purposes


Offline Sue

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Re: Will partial WC increase KH?
« Reply #1 on: June 19, 2014, 07:40:04 PM »
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What is your nitrite reading now? You say nitrites appeared but not if they have now disappeared. The cycle is finished when both ammonia and nitrite stay at zero without having to do water changes.
Nitrate tests are not terribly accurate and are best used to monitor a trend, like a continual rise to show the last stages of cycling. Yours is going up which shows you are near if not actually at the end. Nitrate will increase as the nitrite eaters grow, but the cycle is only finished when you have enough to eat all the nitrite made by the ammonia eaters.

Yes pH will go up with adding remin salts. You needed the KH high for cycling but as long as you keep the KH as around 3 you should be OK once the cycle has finished. Water changes will help replenish the KH. Since your tapwater has a very low KH, you might need to add a tiny amount of remin salts to keep the KH at 3, but it won't take much so it shouldn't affect the pH very much.

As you add more fish the amount of nitrate being made will increase. Nitrate and some of the hormones made by fish are acidic. The more there are, the faster they will use up the KH, so I would keep an eye on your pH regularly.
When I first had fish I was quite lazy about water changes. We didn't have internet access back then and twice I had an unexplained tank wipeout. The last time was 2002 - I remember the date as it happened the week after we had double glazing installed. I now suspect that it was because I was only doing water changes every 3 or 4 weeks, and I was overstocked. This made a lot of acid and allowed it to build up in the tank, which exhausted my low KH and dropped the pH dangerously low. And I didn't test the water back then either.

When you get more fish, add them a few at a time so you don't overwhelm the filter bacteria. Wait at least a week between additions and make sure your ammonia and nitrite stay at zero for that week.

Offline Digs1923

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Re: Will partial WC increase KH?
« Reply #2 on: June 19, 2014, 09:10:06 PM »
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Thanks for speedy response Sue.  Yes, the nitrites are now at 0 (without WC) and the nitrates are definitely orange.  I'm starting to understand (well, sort of) the chemistry involved around water, pH, KH etc.  And all down to the good advice I've received from this forum  :)   Think I'm ready for my chemistry GCSE now, lol.

I'm going to do a WC tonight, mainly as I won't be at home til Sunday evening and haven't done one for four days so thought it best to do one.  Don't think I'll add any remin salts tonight as the KH is at 2.8 and hopefully the WC will raise it a bit.  If it's dropped below 2.8 by Sunday, I'll do a WC adding a tiny amount of salts as you advise.

How awful you lost all your fish  :(   You must have been gutted...  Hopefully I can learn from your bad experience and avoid a similar catastrophe!  Once my tank HAS cycled, how often do you suggest I do a WC?  Once a week or more frequently?

If all's well (test-wise) by next weekend, I plan on getting two more Black Widows so I'll have a "gang" of 5  ;D  Exciting times, lol   :fishy1:     :fishy1:

Liz

A Selection of Fish in my Fish Community Creator Tanks
Black Widow Tetra (4) - Glowlight Tetra (7) - Cardinal Tetra (7) -
Note: The user may not necessarily own these fish, these are tanks that they may be building or researching for stocking purposes


Offline ColinB

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Re: Will partial WC increase KH?
« Reply #3 on: June 20, 2014, 08:07:25 AM »
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This is all sounding good.

As for water changes.... that depends on the differences between the water you're adding and the water in the tank. If you find that you need to add remineralising salts and that this does cause a pH change, then you might be better off doing two 5 litre changes per week rather than one 10 litre change, depending how big a difference there is.

A Selection of Fish in my Fish Community Creator Tanks
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Offline Sue

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Re: Will partial WC increase KH?
« Reply #4 on: June 20, 2014, 12:11:06 PM »
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Certainly in the short term while you are washing the remin salts out of the tank, small frequent water changes are better. After a few weeks, when the tank is just tapwater again and you are using just tapwater to refill, keep an eye on your KH and pH after a couple of days. If you find these are stable over a week, you can do weekly water changes of around 25%. If they both fall, do smaller water changes a couple of times a week.

Remember that more fish will make more nitrate, and as nitrate is acidic the raised amount will use your KH faster. So you need to test pH and KH again a few days after adding more fish just in case. This testing is a nuisance but until you know it is safe to do weekly water changes you'll catch any drop in pH as soon as it starts rather than only find out when it's dropped off the bottom of the chart.

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