CYCLING WITH FISH Discussion Thread

Hi Wild Rover.

1) It can be normal. I've come across a comment by an American recently which said that all the slow cycling he'd come across was in the UK. He suspected that our water companies are good at killing bacteria, including the ones we want to grow in the filter. And of course, fish-in cycling does take longer than fishless because of having to do keep the ammonia, and then nitrite levels very low.
Do the water changes get your ammonia down from your 0.5/1.0ppm to undectable (or at the very least, well under 0.25)? At levels above 0.25, long term damage can be done to the fish. The same applies to nitrite as well when you get some.
Do you have a pH for your tank? Ammonia is less toxic below 7.0, the lower the better; and nitrite is more toxic at lower pH.

2) Tap Safe is fine, but if it is bioactive tap safe, ignore the part about it boosting filter performance. According to Interpet's on-line catalogue, it does not contain anything to detoxify ammonia. Some of these products interfere with the ammonia tester, but tap safe won't so your readings are accurate.
Overdosing to 1.5 or possibly 2x the dose is usually OK. You can buy syringes from a pharmacy to dose small amounts. I have a 1ml syringe which is graduated to hundredths of a ml. They sell larger ones too. But ask for a babies medicine dosing syringe or you'll get funny looks if you ask for just a syringe. Or look on ebay/amazon.

3) Unless your filter media is extremely mucky, don't touch the filter. The bacteria grow in the biofilm attached to surfaces and it does take a while for the biofilm to grow and become firmly attached. Don't do anything to disturb the biofilm just yet, and be very gentle cleaning the filter for a few months when it needs to be done.

Strictly speaking, you should do another water change to get it below 0.25, but as you posted this last evening, it is a bit to late to say that now  [I usually turn my laptop off at 7.45]

The aim is to do a water change as often and as big as necessary to stop the ammonia (and later nitrite) ever getting as high as 0.25. If it is at 0.25 after a water change, it will only go over that before you test again. With a 64 litre tank, it isn't that hard to do big water changes. I have a 125, a 50 and a 30 litre tanks, so I know how much effort a 64 litre would be 
Ammonia burns fish's skin and gills - and that makes it harder for them to absorb oxygen from the water. Nitrite binds to the red blood cells stopping them carrying oxygen round the body, the same way that carbon monoxide kills us.

Your pH is at a level where any ammonia in the water will be quite toxic, so those water changes are more important. Ammonia and ammonium are in an equilibrium. The higher the pH, the more that is in the ammonia form. At lower pH, more is in the less toxic ammonium form. Your pH isn't as bad as the 8 that some regions have, but it is still a bit too high for having ammonia in the water.
With soft water, it is possible you have a low KH (carbonate hardness). You can buy testers for that but it would be cheaper if you asked a fish shop to test a sample of your tap water for KH. The filter bacteria need a source of inorganic carbon - ie carbonate - in the water in order to multiply quickly. If your KH is low, that could be slowing them down. If you do get it tested and find that it is below 5, the best thing to do would be to add some coral or limestone to the tank - a piece of coral, a bag of crushed coral, a limestone rock - as they would slowly dissolve putting carbonate in the water. With fish in the tank, the method for raising carbonate in a fishless cycle can't be used.

At last! Five weeks into the cycle and I have my first Nitrites. Some just take longer than others I guess. 

Me again 

It's now 8 weeks in. After 6 weeks I was reading 0 Ammonia and .25 Nitrites. Nitrites then also unexpectedly dropped to 0 and stayed 0 for a few days which suprised me as you said that it takes longer for Nitrites to be converted than for Ammonia. I added two more Dwarf Rainbow. Nitrates was about 20/30 ppm.
I have added 4 Cardinals and two Rams since then so I now have 6 Dwarf Rainbow, 2 Rams and 4 Cardinal Tetra's. The strange thing is I am now getting zero readings for everything including nitrates!  PH is around 6.5

I have been doing almost daily 10% water changes but have left it for a few days to see if there was any change but still all nil tonight. Still using the same API kit in the same way. The only live plants I have are three moss balls and some Java moss which I have attatched to my bogwood. All fish seem very happy and eating well. Can these readings be right?

Thanks

Thanks Sue

It took 5 weeks to get my first Nitrite reading (see earlier comment) and I still had Ammonia. By week 6 Ammonia was zero and by week seven, so was Nitrites. I guess my main query is whether it could be right to have zero Nitrates as well, with 12 fish in the tank and not done a water change for a few days?

What water changing regime would you suggest from here on?

I shake it with the best of them! 

Unfortunately the stocking calculator on here only allows me four more Cardinals...

So despite only having my first tank for two months I have just bought a second hand Jewel Rio 180!! Can't wait 

I bet many do this right?

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