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Fishless Cycling Problem

Author Topic: Fishless cycling problem  (Read 27500 times)

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Offline Sue

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Re: Fishless cycling problem
« Reply #400 on: April 25, 2017, 08:21:05 PM »
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The test kits should be OK to the end provided they are still within the expiry date or have been opened less than a year. (We used to have a member on here who worked for API and she said that an opened bottle should be thrown away once it reached a year after opening. Just because the oxygen in the air that gets into the bottle reacts with the ingredients).

Interesting about the phantoms. A though occurs - could they see their refection with the background in place so they thought there were more phantoms in that place and tried to shoal with them  ???

Offline barneyadi

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Re: Fishless cycling problem
« Reply #401 on: April 27, 2017, 10:59:27 PM »
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Hi Sue

I don't think they could see their reflections. Since taking the background down they have come out a little more, although if i got to tank they hide again.

Offline Sue

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Re: Fishless cycling problem
« Reply #402 on: April 28, 2017, 09:31:21 AM »
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My hengels rasboras are like that. If I sit quietly at the other side of the room they go all over the tank but as soon as they see movement they dash into the back corner behind a tall plant. I think it must be just the way some fish are.

On the other hand, the rice fish ignore all movement and I have to be careful not to suck them up while cleaning the tank because they fuss around the siphon tube.

Offline barneyadi

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Re: Fishless cycling problem
« Reply #403 on: April 30, 2017, 07:12:37 PM »
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I have read that Black Phantoms don't like bright light. I am wondering if I should change bulbs to what they call a warm yellow light, instead of the bright daylight bulb I have already. Could that make a difference?

Offline Sue

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Re: Fishless cycling problem
« Reply #404 on: April 30, 2017, 07:21:46 PM »
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I know you don't want live plants but floating live plants really are the best thing for reducing light in the tank. I got some water sprite off Ebay and it is doing so well I have to throw handfuls in the compost on a regular basis.

Other than that I don't know if changing the tubes would work. They are usually made bright enough to grow plants. The warm yellow lights I've had just made the tank look as though someone had used it as a urinal  :sick:

Offline barneyadi

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Re: Fishless cycling problem
« Reply #405 on: April 30, 2017, 07:51:10 PM »
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Ok, will try the water sprite. They sell them in 5's, any idea how many I might need for a 125l tank, measures 80 x 40cm?

Offline Sue

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Re: Fishless cycling problem
« Reply #406 on: April 30, 2017, 08:09:49 PM »
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I stared with 1 pack of a few plants, can't remember how many were in it  :-[ But this plant grows.
I have Ceratopteris cornuta rather than Ceratopteris thalictroides, and mine has plants with leaves radiating from a centre which are about 8 inches across. There are also lots of baby plants about half an inch across and every size in between. The seller I got mine from doesn't have it listed at the moment, but I can tell you I got mine in August last year.
Here are two links on the difference between the two types (though some people reckon they arethe same species)
https://www.flowgrow.de/db/aquaticplants/ceratopteris-cornuta
https://www.flowgrow.de/db/aquaticplants/ceratopteris-thalictroides

I find the water flow keeps the plants in just half the tank. But if it grows too much, just pull some out (checking there are no fish in it) and throw it away. Or even sell it  :)

Offline barneyadi

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Re: Fishless cycling problem
« Reply #407 on: April 30, 2017, 09:23:57 PM »
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Thanks Sue

Have ordered a pack of 5 plants, the Cornuta type. Supposedly a mix of small medium and large plants. Will let you know how I get on.

Offline fcmf

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Re: Fishless cycling problem
« Reply #408 on: April 30, 2017, 09:33:52 PM »
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This sounds similar to my experience - take a read of this thread https://forums.thinkfish.co.uk/general-fishkeeping-advice/possible-changes-to-the-tank-thoughts-welcome/

My x-ray tetras hated lighting too but, after 18 months without it, I decided to try again and persevere with it - for the past ten months or so, they've been fine, particularly in conjunction with live plants. The Aqua-Glo light seems to be more subtle for them / their eyes but enhances the fishes' body and fin colours much more than the Sun-Glo light which is brighter but enhances plant colour better (in my opinion).

I haven't updated the thread with the plants I've had recently but, generally, the alternanthera plants and the hygrophila polysperma are a big "hit" as the fish seem to enjoy playing among these plants and also resting and observing tankmates/me from their various positions between the leaves where they must feel comfortable/safe - in essence, they serve the purpose of being somewhere they can play/relax/observe/hide as they desire and simultaneously build up their confidence but without being too hidden as they would be if behind a rock/decor. So hopefully you'll find the plants you've ordered serve a similar purpose.

Hope that helps.

Offline barneyadi

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Re: Fishless cycling problem
« Reply #409 on: May 01, 2017, 07:06:40 PM »
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I had some big brown leaves I brought a while back, cant remember what they are called but put 2 in tank and all the fish are starting to come out more. Only problem with leaves is they sink eventually so hopefully the plants will have a similar effect.

Offline Sue

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Re: Fishless cycling problem
« Reply #410 on: May 01, 2017, 07:16:20 PM »
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If the fish are coming out more while the leaves are floating, that is a good sign.

They sounds like indian almond leaves or cattapa leaves. They are actually a good thing in a tank, so when they sink leave them there till they start to fall apart.

Offline barneyadi

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Re: Fishless cycling problem
« Reply #411 on: May 01, 2017, 09:22:49 PM »
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If the fish are coming out more while the leaves are floating, that is a good sign.

They sounds like indian almond leaves or cattapa leaves. They are actually a good thing in a tank, so when they sink leave them there till they start to fall apart.
They are almond leaves. It says to change them every 2 weeks, is that right? I have 2 in tank at moment.

Offline Sue

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Re: Fishless cycling problem
« Reply #412 on: May 01, 2017, 09:37:05 PM »
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2 weeks sounds about right. They do tend to break down after that time and go all horrible. Once you don't need them to screen the light try using one every week, that way there will always be one newish one and one older one in the tank at the same time.

Warning though, they'll turn the water brownish. If it gets too brown, just use a smaller piece of leaf each time.

Offline barneyadi

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Re: Fishless cycling problem
« Reply #413 on: May 03, 2017, 03:10:48 PM »
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So with my bad luck with Harlequins, would any of the following maybe better?

Glowlight Tetra
Black Neon Tetra
Orange Flame Tetra

I also got my Ceratopteris cornuta today, do they grow quickly, and do I need to do anything to help them grow?

Offline Littlefish

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Re: Fishless cycling problem
« Reply #414 on: May 03, 2017, 04:51:08 PM »
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I only have experience with black neon tetra. I have a group of 10 sharing a tank with lemon tetras, gold stripe cories, Harri & Bertie (BNs). Apparently the black neons are hardier than the neon tetras. I don't know about the flame tetras either, although they do also look like very pretty little fish.
I bought some of the same plants yesterday, as I thought that the dwarf puffers might like them. I haven't planted them yet, and I don't have any previous experience with them. They are in my plant storage tank, waiting for me to decide what to do in the puffer tank.  :)

Offline Sue

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Re: Fishless cycling problem
« Reply #415 on: May 03, 2017, 06:37:08 PM »
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Water sprite, the Ceratopteris, can be planted but also just placed on the water surface. They will grow - the biggest of mine are about 7 to 8 inches across, and they make baby plants. I'm not sure how, yet, whether they grow stems from the centre of the plants with new plantlets which break off, or whether they are like java fern and grow new plantlets from the edges of the leaves. I just know I have huge plants, tiny little plants and everything between.

I do nothing except dose a bit of Seachem Flourish Comprehensive every few weeks. This is a plant fertiliser which contains micronutrients (trace elements). The plants get the macronutrients (potassium, phosphorus and nitrogen) from the fish and fish food.
Since you have only a few fish at the moment, you may find you need to add some macronutrients. Since I don't use those, someone who does may be able to suggest a fertiliser.

Offline barneyadi

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Re: Fishless cycling problem
« Reply #416 on: May 05, 2017, 10:09:55 PM »
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Here's a strange thing. Decided to get some glowlight tetras but could only get them from my local garden centre which supposedly uses ro water along with tap water. Garden centre supposedly on same water as me, did a gh and kh test on water fish were in and turns out exactly same as pets at home. Not sure what's going on!!!

Offline Sue

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Re: Fishless cycling problem
« Reply #417 on: May 06, 2017, 08:59:04 AM »
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I would suggest that either the garden centre has not been using RO (or the person doing water changes wasn't told he should) or Pets at Home don't know what they are doing and someone there does use RO.


You have said in the past that your tap water is soft. How near are the garden centre and Pets at Home? Are they supplied by a different water company from you? Because if they are on the same water company, they too will have soft water so why should the garden centre want to use RO  ???

Offline Matt

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Re: Fishless cycling problem
« Reply #418 on: May 06, 2017, 09:29:17 AM »
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Each water company will have multiple sources of water with varying degrees (literally!!) of hardness but by putting the postcode of each into the relevant water companies website you should be able to find out about their tap water hardness.  I can't imagine either using RO routinely except for certain species due to cost... but I'm not sure on the running of fish shops (often thought they should do guided tours for a small fee, I'm sure there would be lots of people who would love to see it).

Offline barneyadi

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Re: Fishless cycling problem
« Reply #419 on: May 06, 2017, 11:19:57 AM »
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Well Pets at home are on different water, moderately hard according to water board. The garden centre should be on same water as me as they are just down road, and according to water board their water should be moderately soft like mine, but their gh is 16 whilst mine is 7.

Offline Littlefish

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Re: Fishless cycling problem
« Reply #420 on: May 06, 2017, 11:45:33 AM »
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Wow, that is quite some difference.  :o

Offline barneyadi

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Re: Fishless cycling problem
« Reply #421 on: May 13, 2017, 11:07:21 AM »
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Just thought I'd give a quick update on things. Added some more black phantom tetras yesterday to make 11 in total. Suddenly most seem more confident and are coming out more. Gave all the fish some freeze dried bloodworm and they went mad for it. But will use as a treat 2 to 3 times a week. Sadly lost one of my last two Harlequins yesterday,  but have decided to hold off adding any more of them for now. Next will be to add some more glowlight tetra to make their group 11/12 strong then will have to think about other fish to add. If last harlequin is still around I would like to add more as they are a great looking fish. But if not might think of something else.

Offline barneyadi

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Re: Fishless cycling problem
« Reply #422 on: May 19, 2017, 06:46:12 PM »
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Had a fatality today, but was fishes own fault. Was doing water change and hoovering sand and all fish were around the tube when one got sucked up by the tube. I noticed and thought he had swam out. Went and emptied bucket and on starting to clean sand noticed he was sadly in tube and it had been out of water too long.

So note to self to double check if happens again.

Offline Littlefish

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Re: Fishless cycling problem
« Reply #423 on: May 19, 2017, 07:19:50 PM »
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Sorry to hear about your fish incident.
I think most of us have had problems with fish getting too close to the syphon. I certainly have. I syphoned up some fry that I didn't know existed last week, but was lucky that they were so small that they ended up in the bucket and I noticed before disposing of the water, so managed to get them back into the quarantine tank.
Tank maintenance can be quite difficult when the fish are inquisitive.

Offline Sue

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Re: Fishless cycling problem
« Reply #424 on: May 19, 2017, 07:33:48 PM »
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I have problems with the ricefish coming close to the siphon tubes and the cherry shrimps just sit there and refuse to move. I have to siphon round them  :o

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Re: Fishless cycling problem
« Reply #425 on: May 19, 2017, 10:08:56 PM »
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I rescued 11 baby shrimp from one 15 litre bucket the other week... and 2 from the floor the week before where I'd put a pile of plants I was removing... all survived luckily, that said I never thought of checking the tube itself  :-[

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