FISHLESS CYCLING Discussion Thread

Author Topic: FISHLESS CYCLING Discussion Thread  (Read 13648 times) 83 replies

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Offline Sue

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Re: FISHLESS CYCLING Discussion Thread
« Reply #60 on: June 13, 2017, 07:41:28 PM »
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This is where I found the ammonia http://www.ukconsumerinfo.com/productdetails.aspx?prod=417
There is a 'contact us' at the top of the page, which is how I emailed them.


Unfortunately, most home ammonia testers are the salicylate test, and they are all the same colour change.

Offline FoundNemo

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Re: FISHLESS CYCLING Discussion Thread
« Reply #61 on: June 13, 2017, 08:00:39 PM »
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it is what it is I suppose. My cycle has started so I'm happy :D

I will email jeyes though just to see

Thanks again sue

I'll no doubt be asking more later down the line

Offline Sue

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Re: FISHLESS CYCLING Discussion Thread
« Reply #62 on: June 13, 2017, 08:06:23 PM »
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How much chemistry have you studied? At the risk of saying what you already know (and in case anyone else reading this wonders) the link gives the contents as ammonium hydroxide. This is formed when ammonia dissolves in water, so ammonia solution is ammonium hydroxide.

Offline FoundNemo

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Re: FISHLESS CYCLING Discussion Thread
« Reply #63 on: June 13, 2017, 08:21:54 PM »
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I never studied chemistry at school only physics.
So there's no risk of you saying what I already know. I'm sure I'll know a lot more about it with this venture though

Offline FoundNemo

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Re: FISHLESS CYCLING Discussion Thread
« Reply #64 on: June 16, 2017, 06:42:51 PM »
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Ok so today is my 3rd day into my cycle and I've just tested my water for ammonia and nitrite. I believe that my ammonia lvl is the same as day 1 around 3ppm and that my nitrite lvls are about 0.75ppm. I've attached a couple of photos showing the vials. I'd appreciate if somebody could confirm this. I need to get my head round these colours.

Thanks in the advance

Offline Sue

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Re: FISHLESS CYCLING Discussion Thread
« Reply #65 on: June 16, 2017, 07:31:57 PM »
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To my mind the nitrite shows that you already have some ammonia eating bacteria at work turning ammonia into nitrite. But because 1 ppm ammonia is turned into 2.7 ppm nitrite, it doesn't take much of a reduction in ammonia to show a reading for nitrite. I know that screen settings can make the colours look different, but your nitrite looks around 0.25, which means you've lost 0.1 ppm ammonia - and this is hardly detectable.

Be prepared for the nitrite colour to shoot up to the highest on the chart. Our kits don't measure very high (the API nitrite tester only goes up to 5 ppm) and nitrite will get higher. As long as it remains under 15 ppm, that's fine.

Offline FoundNemo

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Re: FISHLESS CYCLING Discussion Thread
« Reply #66 on: June 16, 2017, 07:54:30 PM »
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When I tested my plain tap water for nitrite it was blue. So I'm on my way to seeding my filter 😀

How would I know that my nitrite lvls are below 15ppm if the kit only measures up to 5ppm?

But all I'm looking for right now is my ammonia to be less than 0.75 and nitrite to be over 2 at which point I add another full dose of ammonia. And start testing every 2 days instead of 3

Offline Sue

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Re: FISHLESS CYCLING Discussion Thread
« Reply #67 on: June 16, 2017, 09:01:08 PM »
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The method was written so that , if followed properly, nitrite can never get over 15. But you can always mix some tank water with tap water and test that. 1 part tank to 3 parts tap should get the reading somewhere on the scale. It won't be terribly accurate without very precise measuring equipment but it will give a rough idea of how high it is.

Offline FoundNemo

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Re: FISHLESS CYCLING Discussion Thread
« Reply #68 on: June 16, 2017, 09:09:37 PM »
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Right ok.  I won't be straying away from your guide anyway. I will do the 3/1 testing though when my nitrite test reads 5+ppm. Let's me see the colour variations as well. Thanks again sue

Offline FoundNemo

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Re: FISHLESS CYCLING Discussion Thread
« Reply #69 on: June 23, 2017, 12:27:25 PM »
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Ok so I'm on my 3rd test day for ammonia and nitrite after adding my initial dose of ammonia. I'm still struggling with the colour chart which is really beginning to annoy me as it shouldn't be this difficult. So today I tested the ammonia in my tank water, 3/1 ratio of tap/tank water and straight tap water. I'd appreciate people's comments on this please. Straight tap water is definitely yellow. 3/1 ratio to me looks like it's between 0.5 & 1ppm which would put my tank water between 1.5 & 3ppm

Thanks in advance

Offline FoundNemo

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Re: FISHLESS CYCLING Discussion Thread
« Reply #70 on: June 23, 2017, 01:05:05 PM »
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Here is my nitrite test vials
Tank water, 3/1 ratio tap/tank water and straight tap water

Again straight tap water is definitely zero
3/1 ratio looks to be between 0 and 0.25ppm maybe even 0.5ppm
Which puts my tank result at 0.75 & 1.5ppm

Offline adenann

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Re: FISHLESS CYCLING Discussion Thread
« Reply #71 on: June 23, 2017, 02:36:56 PM »
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 :wave:
@FoundNemo
Here's my take on your readings:-

    NH3
    I agree with your interpretation of colours.
    Tank I see closer to 1ppm than 2ppm
    3:1 mix nearer 0.50ppm
    Tap zero

    NO2
    Tank, I think, is spot on 2.0ppm
    3:1 mix spot on 0.25ppm
    Tap zero

The problem is that printed colours never come out as natural, yellow in particular.  There's a technical term for it that I can't recall for the moment.  I have the same problem with my NT Labs tests where my NH3 always comes out a light straw colour but the card shows a deep yellow.  Your API tests also have a lot of blues and greens.  You're not colourblind by any chance?

Unless you use some fancy, i.e. expensive, kit, whatever measure you get is going to be an approximation and also bear in mind that we're dealing in very small concentrations, parts per million.
 :cheers:

Offline Sue

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Re: FISHLESS CYCLING Discussion Thread
« Reply #72 on: June 23, 2017, 02:51:15 PM »
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I had just finished typing when Adenann posted, but I'll post what I'd written anyway.....


It can be difficult comparing colours on a computer screen, but your readings look to me:

Ammonia -
Tap - zero
Pure tank - slightly less than 2 but not nearly as low as 1
Diluted - 0.5


Nitrite -
Tap - zero
Pure tank -  the 2 and 5 colours look the same on my screen, so your vial could be either  :-\
Diluted - 0.25



It is quite difficult to make really accurate testers for use in the home. People's eyesight varies which adds in other inaccuracy factor. Labs use colour sensing equipment to get accurate results, which is impractical and unaffordable for home use, so we are stuck with our test kits - unless you want to buy a colorimeter.





Have you seen the progress of my fishless cycle at the bottom of the actual method? That should give an idea of what to expect.

Offline FoundNemo

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Re: FISHLESS CYCLING Discussion Thread
« Reply #73 on: June 23, 2017, 03:45:55 PM »
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Thank you adenann and sue.

@adenann I'm not coloured blind. I would have said if I was as that's a bit of critical info.

I only came to my tank water conclusions after testing both the 3/1 and tap for a comparison, so I think I may just carry on doing it that way.

@Sue  I have read through your guide several times. It's probably just my 1st time jitters.

Thanks again

Offline Sue

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Re: FISHLESS CYCLING Discussion Thread
« Reply #74 on: June 23, 2017, 04:02:26 PM »
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I have only actually done 2 fishless cycles, one in 2016 using this method and one in 2013 using the older fishless method. But I had tested my tank on countless occasions before I did the two cycles, so I was very familiar with the testers.

All sorts of things can affect the way we see colours. I have a yellow cataract developing in my right eye (apparently there are several types of cataract and my optician says I have a yellow one). If I look at white typing on a black screen and close one eye, the text looks pale yellow with my right eye and bluish with my left eye. This probably distorts the way I see colours, and once the cataract gets to a certain stage and it is replaced, I'll probably have trouble seeing true colours again till my brain adapts.

Offline Littlefish

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Re: FISHLESS CYCLING Discussion Thread
« Reply #75 on: June 23, 2017, 07:55:41 PM »
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Nothing wrong with first time jitters.
I still get a bit twitchy with cycling tanks and I've done quite a few in the past 18 months, seeded with mature media from other tanks.  :)
We all want the best for our fishy friends and want to create a great environment that they will be happy in.
Keep at it, it will all work out in the end.  :cheers:

Offline kuukelite

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Re: FISHLESS CYCLING Discussion Thread
« Reply #76 on: February 11, 2018, 06:43:37 PM »
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Hi all,

For anybody reading I just want to confirm my successful cycle following Sue's kind help.

Here is a little breakdown:



Offline Rustle

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Re: FISHLESS CYCLING Discussion Thread
« Reply #77 on: February 11, 2018, 07:30:57 PM »
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Nice one.  :) I am on the 4th day of cycling my shrimp tank  so early days for me.

A Selection of Fish in my Fish Community Creator Tanks
Cherry Barb (6) - Neon Tetra (7) - Harlequin Rasbora (11) - Honey Gourami (2) - Guppy (male) (3) - Otocinclus (5) - Japonica Shrimp (8) -
Note: The user may not necessarily own these fish, these are tanks that they may be building or researching for stocking purposes


Offline Matt

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Re: FISHLESS CYCLING Discussion Thread
« Reply #78 on: February 12, 2018, 06:25:41 AM »
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Hi all,

For anybody reading I just want to confirm my successful cycle following Sue's kind help.

Here is a little breakdown:

@kuukelite
If you now add 3ppm ammonia does it disappear along with nitrites within 24 hours?

Offline kuukelite

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Re: FISHLESS CYCLING Discussion Thread
« Reply #79 on: February 18, 2018, 05:23:47 PM »
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Hi @Matt unfortunately not, I decided a couple of days later to double check it had cycled and added the 3ppm, 24 hours later I still had nitrite, around 2. I am now back on 24 hour stage!

Glad I checked!! Not sure why on the 11th I got zero readings of both ammonia/nitrite after 24 hours 3ppm!

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