How To Improve My Plant Health

I've been attempting to keep live plants for 18 months, and use Seachem Flourish liquid fertiliser plus root tabs (previously API, currently Easylife root sticks). Plants survive for anything between a few days and a few months. Sometimes a plant almost seems to be thriving but a change in location in the tank or another plant overlapping it causes a demise. Sometimes a plant such as anubias can be perfectly fine kept in its pot but, when transferred onto wood, dies swiftly. Some plants have thriving top leaves but the leaves underneath look as though they're nutritionally malnourished eg manganese, iron, potassium, magnesium, etc, judging by the plant diagnosis charts. Other plants have lower leaves thriving but the upper leaves almost look as though they've been burnt by the lighting. Sometimes floating plants have a slight smell as though they've been singed by the lighting. Black beard algae takes a hold on many of the plants.

While flicking through some aquatic magazines lately, I noticed a couple of articles - one on substrates, one on using a pair of old tights to act as a plant pot. Apart from the plants which can be grown on wood, I keep my plants, along with their rock wool, in the black plastic containers which they come in. I was thinking that, if I bought a suitable nutrient-supplying substrate, I could perhaps attempt growing some plants in this inside the tights (fastened at the top with a loose cable-tie) and buried in the existing substrate rather than either changing the entire substrate and rather than continuing with the plants-in-original-pots route - this would give the plants a better chance than them being constricted in their existing containers.

Reading the article about substrates, it looks as though complete substrates contain a lot of nitrogen-based compounds including ammonia which would be a risk to my fish given that my tank is already stocked, as well as soil reducing PH ?and water hardness; would these also apply to Seachem Flourite and Caribsea Eco Complete which are not soil-based but instead fracted clay gravel? Layered substrates appear to be an alternative option, possibly better in my case?

Any views/thoughts on the above? Any potential problems, especially with my very soft water? No risks to my fish and snail are paramount!

Thanks.

[Subsequently edited to correct the name of my liquid fertiliser - for some reason, I keep calling it by the wrong name!]

Thanks, Sue - so this leaching of ammonia would apply to all substrates, not just soil? The one I'm "eyeing up" online is the Tropica Plant Growth Substrate which seems to be clay and sphagnum.

Yes, I do indeed remember Richard W's posts - I'll have a hunt around for those again...

Thanks for your reply, M.

I would rather no risks than reduced risks to livestock, so, even if effectiveness of the substrate is compromised, I'd rather try the clay (with the possibility that the plant situation might improve) than soil (with an increased possibility of the plant situation improving but a slight risk to livestock, even if small). If I've understood the relative risk accordingly, might the clay be worth a go then rather than the soil?

How are you using root tabs when your plants are in the pots they came in?  Rock wool is inert but enriched with a fertilized water when potted, I suspect this then leaches into the sale tank at the shop and so is inert when you get it.  It might be worth trying them in the substrate with root tabs beneath them first.

I'm lifting the plant-with-rock wool up and inserting a root tab in the centre of the little clay/terracotta ring (if it exists, or using an old clay/terracotta ring if the plant doesn't come with one), then replacing the plant-with-rock wool on top of that.

What I'm struggling to understand is the death of your anubias. I have been pretty brutal with mine and they have always survived... I've taken leaves off by accident and they have survived for ages too... I honestly can't imagine it dying in a couple of days... what did it look like?

It went a very dark shade and the leaves turned to slime, so that even touching them just caused them to slip off the wood in slimy mess.

What is your reasoning for leaving the plants in their original pots? Every time I buy / move a plant, I free up the roots, and trim them, usually to about an inch long. If the plant has come out of a pot, I still trim a little off the largest roots. And again I do this for plants that don't go in the substrate, like anubias. I do this because trimming the roots (or shoots) promotes growth in that area. If I want the roots to grow, I trim them; if I want the stems to grow I trim them.

So I agree with @Matt and think that your starting point should be getting all your existing plants out of their original pots.

Plant the plants deeper if they won't stand up and you can push their roots through one of those ceramic rings in the bottom of the pot if it helps them stand. Or do you think they were floating out rather than falling - lead weights are the answer here. And don't clean the substrate around the plants as they will do this for you (apart from the surface) and won't want to be disturbed in this way.

I don't regularly gravel clean the planted areas of my tank (which is most of it!!) It just gets done once every month / couple of months.

Personally I would avoid tights of substrate - it would not look natural enough or tidy enough for me (personal view of course...) and I don't think lack of specific planting substrate is the issue you are facing, as the plants haven't been in normal substrate yet and able to access the nutrients in the root tab efficiently.

Sorry I feel like I'm forcing you down a route here... I really do believe you should try planting the plants though to allow them to grow more naturally, as they were designed. This seems to be the main difference between your approach and mine.  I have the plants planted in the substrate with root tabs underneath (I do have problems with them floating before they get established root systems, hence my earlier comment) and I dose a product similar to flourish.

@fcmf I'm no plant expert, but my guess is we must have fairly similar water conditions and I have managed to get things to grow by a combination of tweaking lighting, adding CO2 or dumb luck. If it helps this is what I do....
Base water for me is 6.7pH and 0.5Kh so CO2 is low at 3.1ppm however even though I have inert sand substrate the main planted tank raises the water Kh to 1.5. I measure Kh very accurately every week without fail as this is actually the controlling factor for CO2 with soft water parameters (for hard water its pH)
I use a timed yeast CO2 injection and lower the pH to 6.3 (22.8ppm CO2) and this has produced by far the biggest improvement in plant happiness of anything I have done.
There are two quite powerful LED lighting strips that are on for a total of 9 hours per day with a 5 hour rest mid-day. The tank is 60cm deep and gets a bit of daylight with the sun being so low in the sky at the moment and I believe this sunlight is currently triggering a bit of BBA growth, but I'm living with it.
I actively run my tanks at 20ppm NO3, they gain 7 or 8 ppm each week, and weekly water change just what is needed to get back to 20ppm I add 30ml of liquid feed twice weekly.
I have fertiliser tablets pushed under the strongly rooted plants, I don't have a real schedule for topping these up, just add more if I see any yellowing going on.
I think all my plants would be classed as low light and easy, probably a boring selection but they are growing well so I'm happy.

Do you use a typical siphon tube to do a water change; that is, one with flexible tubing attached to a wide rigid cylinder? I find it much easier with sand to use a wine making siphon. These are just a flexible tube with a rigid tube the same width as the flexible tubing. They do come with a sort of cup that slots into the rigid tube, but I don't use that, or the tap that is on the other end. The advantage for me is that being so narrow it will fit into tiny gaps without demolishing half the decor.
Like this http://www.wilko.com/homebrew-accessories+equipment/wilko-syphon-pack/invt/0022573

I start the siphon by filling the tubing with tap water, then carry it over to the tank with the open ends held upwards. Then I put a finger over the end of the rigid tube, put the other end in the bucket and the rigid end in the tank, then take my finger off the end in the tank.

You could probably add more sand to help keep the plants down, but there are a couple things you can try before then.

Are the pots sitting on top of the sand?

I would suggest choosing a couple of plants to start with (possibly not the Vallis or the crypt - I'll explain why for those in a bit). Take the plant you've chosen out of the pot and remove all of the rock wool. With a sharp pair of scissors, trim the tips of the largest / longest roots. I find that the best place to make a cut is just below where the roots branch. Then put the plant back in the pot and feed as many of the roots as possible through the holes in the pot / basket. Bury the pot in the sand of your tank until the bottom of the pot is on the bottom of the tank. Fill the pot with sand. If you have any gravel and / or plant weights try putting these in the pot. The lower down the pot they are, the more sand you can cover them with, so they don't show. Also make sure that all roots extending beyond the pot are completely buried under the sand.

By putting the roots through the pot, the pot won't be restricting the growth of the plants. And as well as weighting down the pots and plants, the gravel will also help increase the water space around the roots and therefore circulation.

The reason I've suggested not starting with the crypt is that they particularly don't like their roots being messed with and suffer something called crypt melt. This is a particularly dramatic version of something a lot of plants do which is to shed their leaves and grow a completely new set. With crypts they look totally dead and lots of people dig up the roots. But if you can cope with leaving the roots untouched, where they are, crypts will usually grow back and be fine.

I've suggested not starting with Vallis for a different reason. They propagate by sending out little runners that then root when they touch the substrate. With the other plants, putting them back in the pots should be fine. But if your Vallis sends out runners from the pot, you could well get into a tangle with the pot, roots and runners.

Good luck.

Thanks, folks.

Unfortunately, my attempts since a couple of evenings ago have gone rather awry.

I tried to re-plant a couple of the plants back into pots as per H's helpful suggestion, with the rockwool replaced by sand and some small stones I have - this resulted in broken stalks/roots, the sand leaking out from the holes in the pots (even although I chose the variation with the fewest holes) and a very cloudy tank as a result of moving and piling up so much sand round the side of the pots in an effort to keep them in the sand, upright and stop the sand leaking out. I ended up retrieving the discarded rock wool and have packed it back in to the pots to block the holes.

I also tried using a weight to re-plant another plant - rather than moving and piling up existing sand around it to try to keep it in place, I used new sand in the hope that this would avoid "cloudy tank syndrome" but it unearthed itself within seconds, causing the root tab to disintegrate and furthering the "cloudy tank syndrome".

My fish are not at all happy with me interfering with the tank, so, apart from "non-invasive" (ie water scooped out in a jug from the water surface only and no vacuuming) water changes to try to restore a clear tank, I'm going to give them a break for a while. The "siesta lighting schedule" will definitely have to go on hold as, while they've become accustomed to the current schedule and can pre-empt when lights are about to come on and go off and so prepare themselves accordingly by huddling together in shoals, I'm fairly certain that a change to that regime won't go down very well, at least not at the current time. On a positive note, though, I'm noticing that the latest addition of floating plants in a plant ring over the anubias is helping keep the BBA at bay.

I'm beginning to think I might be best to continue as I have been (despite the high turnover of plants) or else reverting to silk plants again...

With my new aquascaping toolkit, stacking a pile of ceramic rings (from the bottom of plastic plant pots) on top of one another, and hoe-ing sand up to a depth of about 3" high, I have somehow succeeded in planting two plants directly into the sand substrate!  Progress. Time will tell if they manage to stay upright (tetras had better not get up to their 3-males-chasing-after-one-female antics!) and how long they survive for.