How To Improve My Plant Health

Author Topic: How to improve my plant health  (Read 14995 times) 62 replies

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Offline Littlefish

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Re: How to improve my plant health
« Reply #20 on: January 13, 2018, 05:01:38 PM »
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 :cheers:

Offline fcmf

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Re: How to improve my plant health
« Reply #21 on: January 21, 2018, 05:35:28 PM »
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As mentioned in Thinkfish Daily News thread #995-997, I've now decanted all of my plants into the sand substrate - not an easy task! I'm hereby attaching some pics (one taken from the front and one more from above) - they ought to make fellow fishkeepers void of plant-keeping and aquascaping skills/potential feel better about their own efforts but may be the ingredients of nightmares for everyone else on here who will no doubt be horrified at my haphazard planting!

A little word of explanation to accompany the pics:
* the reddish tinge to the tank water is the consequence of the root tabs - hoping this will settle in time;
* filters are both on the RHS - the one at the back is a "waterfall" type filter and may very well uproot the plants there, while the one at the front has its outflow nozzle tilted to the right, sending the water circulating in an anti-clockwise direction round the tank;
* the taller plants (possibly hygrophila guensis) probably ought to be at the back and it may seem odd that they're on the LHS but they're very wiry and need propped up by something - the wood is ideal for this, and, in turn, the healthier leaves higher up on the plants reduce the growth rate of the BBA on the anubias attached to the wood, so this seemed the best location for them (and the wood looks best from this angle) - this hasn't been doing too well, with the lower leaves experiencing brown diatoms and many/most of the lower leaves dying;
* there is vallis at the back LHS (probably not visible in the photo) - it's the one that has definitely suffered since tampering with it, so I don't expect it'll survive much longer;
* there is hemiographis colorata also at the back LHS - what's left of it after a not-too-successful decant recently (lots of leaves detached from the roots/stalks when detaching it from the rockwool); once these die off, I'll probably buy some taller plants for that location, if there are any which can stand up on their own accord and don't need propped up;
* at the back on the RHS, there is echinodorus martii ;
* at the RHS, there is something small TBC which I can't seem to find the label for (but will update if I find it);
* at the front LHS, there is a new hemiographis colorata and a new alternanthera rosaefolia - probably too large for the front but there doesn't seem to be space for them anywhere else - they might be better moved to the LHS or the back LHS once those die off (and if the rosaefolia survives that long - I do like them but have had rather a lot of them in the past 19 months);
* at the front RHS, there is a cryptocoryne petchii and slightly behind it and to the side higher up, some very BBA-ridden anubias on the wood (although this isn't as bad as it was after I put floating plants in a fish feeding ring immediately above it - these have died off).

If anyone can bear to take a look at the pics, then comments welcome. In order to let the tank settle, I won't be doing any more re-arranging until just before the next water change, though. Incidentally, for some reason, the tank always looks far more bare in photos than it actually is - the fish seem to have very little swimming space in real life but the photos don't reflect this at all.

@Matt - you'll see the two scratch marks down the front of the tank if you look at the pics close up - so be careful with any algae magnet cleaners on your new tank (and any other new tank owners, for that matter!).

Offline Littlefish

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Re: How to improve my plant health
« Reply #22 on: January 21, 2018, 05:47:24 PM »
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I think that you've done well to decant your plants an put them directly into the substrate.  :cheers:

The plants themselves don't look anywhere near as bad as you've described, and once they've had a few days/weeks to settle in you can review them again.

As well as the root tabs, are you dosing any liquid fertiliser and carbon?

Offline fcmf

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Re: How to improve my plant health
« Reply #23 on: January 21, 2018, 06:03:44 PM »
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Aw, thanks for your kind words, @Littlefish. Maybe just as well the red cloudy tinge is there so that you can't see them too clearly! :)

As well as the root tabs, are you dosing any liquid fertiliser and carbon?
Besides the root tabs, Seachem Flourish is the only other product used. I'm terrified of using CO2, for fear of inadvertently overdosing - I seem to be particularly clumsy when it comes to fishkeeping and have so many mishaps during water changes (mouthfuls of water when starting off the syphon, water drenching the cabinet the fishtank sits on and the other items on that, wet sleeves and clothing, leftover water in the syphon decorating the walls and ceiling, not to mention the floor), that I don't think I'd trust myself with CO2 dosing. Mr FCMF carries the water buckets - probably just as well I can't do those tasks!  :)

Offline Helen

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Re: How to improve my plant health
« Reply #24 on: January 21, 2018, 06:47:38 PM »
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I think you do yourself an injustice with your descriptions. I've discovered that it's not easy to plant live plants into small grain substrate. And your plants are generally all larger leafed than mine, so I would expect them to be more floaty and therefore the job more difficult.

Don't be disheartened if you have to replant the odd one. I've already had to replant several of my larger crypts and I saw a smaller one, the other day, that's no longer in the substrate (which I subsequently seem to have lost!)

Offline Littlefish

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Re: How to improve my plant health
« Reply #25 on: January 21, 2018, 07:06:09 PM »
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Seachem also do Flourish Excel as their liquid carbon/alternative to CO2.
I completely understand the concerns about overdosing a tank. I too am a bit clumsy, and with the exception of mouthfuls of water (I use a syphon bulb thingy), I have been through all the incidents you list on several occasions.
I would still suggest using the Seachem products, but use a 7th of the dose (or less) each day rather than dosing weekly. I would also suggest trying the Flourish Excel, their version of liquid carbon/CO2 alternative. Even if you go with a 50% dose it will still help your plants, without the fear of overdosing. You'd be amazed at how much it helps.

Offline Sue

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Re: How to improve my plant health
« Reply #26 on: January 21, 2018, 07:10:25 PM »
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I don't like these liquid carbon products. They contain glutaraldehyde, a disinfectant. It may not kill my fish bvut it won't to them any good. And if it comes to that, neither does adding CO2 gas.

Unless the tank is high tech planted, these should not be needed. Fish breathe out CO2 and micro-organisms in the substrate break down fish poo, left over food etc to make CO2. It's only those tanks that are aquatic gardens with a few fish that need added CO2 in any form. Fish tanks with some plants don't need it.
And if CO2 is added, more intense light and extra fertiliser are needed to keep things in balance.

Offline Matt

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Re: How to improve my plant health
« Reply #27 on: January 21, 2018, 07:17:30 PM »
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I wouldn't rule out the vallis just yet, it may loose a lot of its leaves but as long as a few remain green it could well bounce back.  I seem to recall they don't like their roots being disturbed much. It might also send runners out to grow new plants

I take it the echinodorus martii and  cryptocoryne petchii are doing ok? They certainly look to be  :D It might be worth purchasing different looking plants of the same species to replace any you loose if they are?  I have found some plants will just work and others will just not in my tanks, possibly something to do with the plants equivalent of water hardness for fish. There are lots of different looking echinodorus certainly which you could maximise on.

 It might be worth taking the anubias out scraping the BBA off with your fingers once the root tabs nutrients have gone from the water column to give this plant the best chance of survival and to stop the BBA spreading.

Can you raise the water level a bit to stop the waterfall effect from being so powerful?

I agree with @Littlefish about dosing daily and small doses of liquid carbon being beneficial. That's exactly what I do.

Thanks for pointing out the scratches... I will be careful!

What is under the wood on the RHS?

I hope some of that ramble helps...

Offline fcmf

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Re: How to improve my plant health
« Reply #28 on: January 21, 2018, 09:05:49 PM »
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Thanks for the kind comments and very useful/helpful replies and tips which I'll definitely take on board - much appreciated. Only able to type a short reply to M's questions so will be brief.

I take it the echinodorus martii and cryptocoryne petchii are doing ok?

Can you raise the water level a bit to stop the waterfall effect from being so powerful?

What is under the wood on the RHS?

Thanks, those two plants are only a week old or so, hence why still looking healthy.

Water level could maybe go up another 1cm but the waterfall effect tends to lose its power very quickly and decreases to a trickle as the filter media clogs up.

An Indian catappa leaf, with the nerite snail racing towards it in the second photo; there are also 2-3 smaller ones scattered around. There is also a terracotta pot on its side on the RHS where I place the snail's food so that the easily fungusable leftovers can be easily retrieved.

Offline Matt

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Re: How to improve my plant health
« Reply #29 on: January 21, 2018, 09:19:44 PM »
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I wonder if your water is particularly tea stained and therefore restricting the light reaching the plants?

Offline Littlefish

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Re: How to improve my plant health
« Reply #30 on: January 21, 2018, 09:42:58 PM »
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I have echinodorus martii major in the river tank...it seems to cope with the water movement. Ilike the shape of the leaves, just something a little bit different than standard.

Offline fcmf

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Re: How to improve my plant health
« Reply #31 on: April 12, 2018, 07:13:56 PM »
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I'm resurrecting this dormant thread and re-inserting a pic I'd posted in the Thinkfish Daily News thread, plus also responding to a query from Matt as to what plants I currently have in my tank. Quote from Matt: @fcmf remind me what plants you have at the moment... and what lighting? I did a bit of research this morning into the two species of plants which are not thriving as much in my tank and I ended up turning up my lights as they both needed more light than the others... funny because one is labelled as 'easy' but actually requires the same levels of lighting as the medium plant...

This is probably a useful exercise for me too, as I'm not good at keeping a note of this! [Also, note to self: write on plant label the date on which I got the plant.]
  • Draped in various locations in the tank, with one end twisted around bogwood: Hornwort (Ceratophyllum demersum)
    Front - left to right: Hygrophila polysperma; Hemiographis colorata; Cryptocoryne beckettii; Vallis - 2 different types;
    Middle - left: Java fern (Microsorium pteropus)
    Back - left to right: Hemiographis colorata; Hygrophila polysperma; Hemiographis colorata; remnants of an Alternanthera rosaefolia; Echinodorus martii x2
    Oversized-for-my-tank plant, wedged in the bogwood to hold it upright and contain it: Echinodorus fancy twist. Also on the right of the bogwood: anubias, which struggles with BBA.
    Middle - right: Cryptocoryne parva.

Lighting is just the bog-standard set-up that came with the tank and I have a T8 Aqua-Glo fluorescent tube in it.

Offline TopCookie

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Re: How to improve my plant health
« Reply #32 on: April 12, 2018, 11:06:21 PM »
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Do you know what would look nice as a finishing touch there fcmf...  some sort of very short carpeting type plants right in the foreground...  Tank still looks great either way, nice and lush indeed...   :D

Offline Helen

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Re: How to improve my plant health
« Reply #33 on: April 12, 2018, 11:40:25 PM »
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The only thing with carpeting plants is that they are notoriously difficult to grow with a standard, low light tank set up. They might just reconfirm fcmf's fears that she can't keep plants. Just when it is becoming obvious that that's not true!

Offline TopCookie

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Re: How to improve my plant health
« Reply #34 on: April 13, 2018, 12:01:11 AM »
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I have one grassy type plant in my tank:  Lilaeopsis brasiliensis

recently, when scouring countless sites selling plants, I came across one short grass like plant that looks just like the LB but is deemed far easier to grow... 

The LB I have is growing and spreading, but very slowly and to the point where I almost bought some of this other grass to supplement it - but for the life of me, I cannot now recall the name of the plant   :vcross: 

It was probably on the Aquarium Gardens site, or the Pro-Shrimp site, so I'll go and see if I can find it again so as to pop the info up on here... 

Not taking anything for granted though and fcmf might not want a grass type plant, nor indeed any such carpeting plants, but worth a look at though...  :)   (if I can find the little tinker...!!!)

Offline TopCookie

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Re: How to improve my plant health
« Reply #35 on: April 13, 2018, 01:50:26 AM »
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Took some finding, but the grass like plant in question is:  Lilaeopsis Mauritiana

http://tropica.com/en/plants/plantdetails/Lilaeopsismauritiana(040B)/4461 

(There are loads of other options of course and not all of them grass like...  This one is just a grass like plant that appeals to me as much as anything else...)

Offline fcmf

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Re: How to improve my plant health
« Reply #36 on: April 13, 2018, 06:14:18 PM »
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Thanks for the suggestion, TC. I agree that something covering the substrate would look nice. However, my only experience of a carpeting plant - some time ago - was with an allegedly "easy level" Eleocharis Acicularis which turned yellow and died within a couple of days.

Currently, the tank is quite 'busy' with a lot of plants shading other ones. This has always been problematic in the past, resulting in the demise of those shaded, so I'm having to be very careful to try to ensure that this doesn't kill any of them off eg the Hygrophila polysperma seems to have shed a lot of leaves overnight and quite a few leaves have gone pale. For now, I think the best option is to try and keep the ones I have in the tank alive (preferably, longer than 3 months!) and thereby gain my confidence, rather than trying anything too complicated - H is 'spot on' in that regard. I've been close on several occasions to reverting back to silk plants but hoping this might be the start of me being able to keep the real ones alive for at least a spell of time.

The suggestion got me thinking, though, and I've consequently wrapped some of the hornwort round the base of some of the plants - meaning fewer plants are shaded while simultaneously having some foliage (if that's the correct term?) at substrate level.

Offline Sue

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Re: How to improve my plant health
« Reply #37 on: April 13, 2018, 06:44:18 PM »
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You could always try some bucephalandra  ;D

These are low light plants which can be attached to decor, so if you attached some to a flat rock or piece of wood, that could be used instead of carpeting (and possibly high light) plants.

Offline fcmf

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Re: How to improve my plant health
« Reply #38 on: April 13, 2018, 07:03:43 PM »
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I could give it a second go; couldn't be any worse than the time I tried it before when it didn't even survive a week before turning into dark slime (cf Bucophalandra Fan Club thread post #54).  :'(

Offline Sue

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Re: How to improve my plant health
« Reply #39 on: April 13, 2018, 07:35:18 PM »
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Ahhh, I missed that comment  :-[ I saw the bit about bolbitis though  ;D

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