Moonbeam Swollen Stomach

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Offline Ally2

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Moonbeam swollen stomach
« on: May 23, 2017, 10:50:57 PM »
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Hi
My betta moonbeam has a swollen stomach for about two weeks . I initially fasted him, then gave him frozen daphnia . He then got a cloudy eye at which point I started giving him myxazin . He had been quiet at the weekend hanging around on his filter . After giving the above withinn 48 hours his eye looked better and I saw what I think was poo hanging from him, after he had the daphnia .
He also perked up and was swimming around.
However his stomach isn't getting better .
I'm concerned it's dropsy . Should I be giving him Epsom salt baths ? He's on his 3rd day of myxazin .
I will try to post photos separately
Ally

Offline Ally2

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Moonbeam stomach
« Reply #1 on: May 23, 2017, 10:54:16 PM »
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Here's pictures

Online Matt

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Re: Moonbeam swollen stomach
« Reply #2 on: May 24, 2017, 06:37:29 AM »
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Are the scales sticking out around the swelling? This is the usual identification methodology for dropsy.

Offline Sue

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Re: Moonbeam swollen stomach
« Reply #3 on: May 24, 2017, 11:29:57 AM »
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Ally, I have merged the two topics (text and photos) so they are both in the same thread.

Since the swelling is not coming down, I would try the epsom salt baths. Do you have the recipe?

Offline Ally2

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Re: Moonbeam swollen stomach
« Reply #4 on: May 24, 2017, 12:57:08 PM »
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Hi
Please tell me the recipe for Epsom salt baths could you tell me in litres and not gallons , I'm not good with conversions , and how often I should do it
Ally

Offline Ally2

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Re: Moonbeam swollen stomach
« Reply #5 on: May 24, 2017, 12:59:52 PM »
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Hi Matt
Looking at him from above I think he looks more swollen on one side . To the naked eye it doesn't look like his scales are raised . But when I enlarge the photo it does slightly but only on the more fatter side .
Ally

Offline Sue

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Re: Moonbeam swollen stomach
« Reply #6 on: May 24, 2017, 05:27:18 PM »
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You will need a container of some sort for the bath, and a second container to rinse him.

The epsom salt should be made up at the rate of 1 level 5ml spoonful per 3.75 litres water. If your tub won't hold that much, scale it down. You need to use dechlorinated water at the same temp as the tank.
Place the fish in the epsom salt water for a maximum of 30 minutes, but watch him and remove him sooner if he shows signs of distress.
So no epsom salt gets into the proper tank, fill a second container with warmed dechlorinated water and transfer him to that from the bath, then back into his tank.

I would do this twice a day.

Offline Ally2

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Re: Moonbeam swollen stomach
« Reply #7 on: May 24, 2017, 06:53:31 PM »
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Hi sue
Can I round it up to 4 litres of water ?
I'm going to have to use a net I hope this won't damage his long fins 🙁How long before i should see an improvement?
Ally

Offline Sue

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Re: Moonbeam swollen stomach
« Reply #8 on: May 24, 2017, 06:59:11 PM »
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Rounding it up should be OK. The 3.75 litres is because the recipe I have says to use 1 US gallon per teaspoon so I converted it.

I'm afraid it will take as long as it takes, if it does work. There is no saying how far any disease has progressed, I'm sorry to say.

Offline Littlefish

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Re: Moonbeam swollen stomach
« Reply #9 on: May 24, 2017, 08:07:44 PM »
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Fingers crossed for you & Moonbeam.
Best of luck.

Offline Ally2

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Re: Moonbeam swollen stomach
« Reply #10 on: May 24, 2017, 10:14:28 PM »
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I did the Epsom bath , and rinse . He's now lying around on the bottom quite a bit looking slightly like his breathing is laboured . He has swam about and eaten . Should I stop the myxazin ? It was his last day with this tommorow (5 days treatment)
I hope I don't loose him almost had him a year .
Ally

Offline Sue

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Re: Moonbeam swollen stomach
« Reply #11 on: May 25, 2017, 10:48:14 AM »
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I would do that last dose of Myxazin, but maybe do only one epsom salt bath a day after the Myxazin has finished.

Offline Ally2

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Re: Moonbeam swollen stomach
« Reply #12 on: May 25, 2017, 01:55:47 PM »
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Hi Sue
Well I thought I was going to wake up to a dead betta this morning , but he swam over for his food ! I've dosed the last myazxin today.
I gave him an Epsom salt bath but only left him for 10 mins . There is a lot of difference in views of how long you should leave them in for from 10-30 mins . For a novice that's a huge difference with some sites saying don't leave longer than 15 mins .
I was really worried I killed him yesterday , I'm going to do 10 min dips once a day and see how we go .
He's been laying on his mossy ball wiggling which he doesn't normally do , when I realised he has spotted a dropped pellet of food and is trying to squeeze down to get it as it's wedged near the glass ! He can't be that ill !
Ally

Offline Littlefish

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Re: Moonbeam swollen stomach
« Reply #13 on: May 25, 2017, 05:42:45 PM »
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I often think that an appetite and an interest in the surroundings is a good sign.
Great to hear that Moonbeam was actively trying to hunt down the pellet.  ;D

Offline Ally2

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Re: Moonbeam swollen stomach/ epsom salt baths
« Reply #14 on: May 28, 2017, 07:18:22 PM »
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Hi
Moonbeam seems to have improved stomach still a bit big, but don't think it's as big as previously . He's had three Espom  baths with a days gap inbetween.
As his stomach hasn't completely gone down should I continue with the baths ?
Ally

Offline Sue

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Re: Moonbeam swollen stomach
« Reply #15 on: May 28, 2017, 07:23:33 PM »
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I would keep on for another couple of days then see how he gets on without any.

Offline Ally2

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Re: Moonbeam swollen stomach
« Reply #16 on: June 02, 2017, 01:53:38 PM »
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Hi
I've now done 4-5 Epsom salt baths . There is no pineconing his stomach seems to go slightly up and down which leads me to suspect he's just not pooing enough . He swims fine and is now only eating frozen daphnia .
I did the myxazin treatment for the recommended amount . I've also done more frequent water changes of ten litres about 3 times per week ( his tank is 22 litres )
I'm now at a loss as what to do . He doesn't seem ill , his stomach isn't sticking out anymore but rather he's looking wider the other way , from his dorsal to his lower fin if you know what. Mean?
I put an almond leave in and have just ordered a new batch so they are fresh from denerale .
Should I try peas ? Do I have a fat betta or if this a problem that going to lead to something else ?
I'm going to upload some better pictures when I take them at the weekend .
Ally

Offline Sue

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Re: Moonbeam swollen stomach
« Reply #17 on: June 02, 2017, 02:00:34 PM »
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There is a difference of opinion on peas - some say you should never feed pea to a betta and that daphnia is a better laxative for them; others say there is no problem with feeding a pea and it could help.

I have to say that I have not had problems with feeding a pea, the only problem is the state of the water afterwards so I always fed it just before a water change.


If Moonbeam is behaving normally, his shape might just be him.

Offline Ally2

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Re: Moonbeam swollen stomach
« Reply #18 on: June 03, 2017, 08:27:56 PM »
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Hi
He's still got a huge tum ! I gave a pea last night , and didn't feed him this morning . I also gave him another Epsom salt bath 5th now.
Nothing is working. He's laying around on his weed a lot, but when swims seems to be ok no difficulty .
I've taken some clear pictures with my SLR camera but The site won't let me upload them !
What else can I do ? He seems slightly more wide on one side , could this be his organs ?
Ally

Offline Sue

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Re: Moonbeam swollen stomach
« Reply #19 on: June 03, 2017, 08:41:13 PM »
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It could be just the way he is, or it could possibly indicate something internal. If the swelling is more on one side than the other, that does suggest something other than constipation.

My betta started resting on plants a lot more last year and he now spends a lot of his time underneath a piece of wood. In this case, I have have put it down to age (I've had him 2 years 3 months). But if Moonbeam is still young, it won't be because of his age. Swimming normally is a good sign, particularly if his fins are in good condition.

I would be inclined to accept that it is just him. Feed him his normal food, but not too much. If it does turn out to be something not right with him, it is likely to be something you can't cure (eg a tumour). Giving him a good quality of life is the best course of action.



Re photos, there is a size limit on the forum. You might need to resize it smaller.

Offline Ally2

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Re: Moonbeam swollen stomach
« Reply #20 on: June 03, 2017, 08:46:18 PM »
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Hi Sue
Before this he was definitely a slim Jim. I bought him June last year he was tiny when I got him . I will try to resize the photos as I think it will help you to see what I'm talking about .
Ally

Offline fcmf

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Re: Moonbeam swollen stomach
« Reply #21 on: June 03, 2017, 09:24:39 PM »
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Just a thought on looking at your photos and based on my own experience. When I transferred my substrate from gravel to sand because my goldfish had a habit of swallowing and choking on the gravel, I ended up with another problem - he foraged and ingested sand in the process. He developed a pouch on his side ie a swollen section internally but which could be seen quite easily when looking at him. When he pooed, it came out extremely thick (must have been painful for him to pass) like Udon noodles rather than standard string, and grains of sand were very visible in it. Is there any possibility that this could be happening in Moonbeam's case? Keep an eye on his poo / him poo-ing and it might help work out if indeed this is what's happening. If so, it may be that you need to change the substrate - in my case, I opted for a bare-bottom tank after the repeated problems with gravel and sand.

Offline Ally2

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Re: Moonbeam swollen stomach
« Reply #22 on: June 03, 2017, 11:14:24 PM »
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Hi
He's had sand a while and before this problem he was only eating floating pellets or flakes . In fact I've had to train him to dive down from soaking the pellets and giving frozen daphnia . Because he couldn't understand where the food had gone as he was so used to getting it from the top . This has been going on for about a month , he could have swallowed a bit of sand but it really started before he was catching it as it fell . I haven't seen him poo that's the problem . When I first gave him the daphnia he did and it was a lot . But that was over a week ago !
Also the sand is quite a large grain , it's not the fine beach kind if you know what I mean .
Thank you for you comments .
Ally

Offline Sue

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Re: Moonbeam swollen stomach
« Reply #23 on: June 04, 2017, 09:48:26 AM »
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I see what you mean from the photos, and it does look to be more on one side.

I have read of bettas with tumours causing swelling on one side; I had a betta years ago with swelling on one side (much worse than Moonbeam) which turned out to be full of yellow goo, but I have no idea what that was caused by.

There are just so many things it could be, and not all of them curable  :(

Offline MarquisMirage

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Re: Moonbeam swollen stomach
« Reply #24 on: June 04, 2017, 12:40:00 PM »
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@Ally2 It looks like you have live plants in your tank.  Do you use anything like root tabs?  I've read about cases of betta swallowing root tabs and ballooning.

Offline Ally2

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Re: Moonbeam swollen stomach
« Reply #25 on: June 04, 2017, 03:59:54 PM »
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Hi
I do use root tabs but they are right under the sand , I could have dislodged when hoovering and it gone in the water I suppose .
Haven't put any in a while though 😩

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