Introducing Newly Purchased Fish To A Tank

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Offline Matt

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Introducing newly purchased fish to a tank
« on: January 27, 2018, 10:22:08 PM »
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I have started acclamating my fish to temperature only then pouring the bag out over a net to catch the fish, then putting them straight into the tank.i do this for two reasons.
1. Ammonia that builds up inside the bag only becomes toxic when the bag is opened, so it's best to get the fish straight out. If you are taking a fish from a hard water tank to software tank you may need to be more careful, but I know my LFS has rouhtly the same water parameters.
2. Since I've started doing it this way I've noticed how much less stressful it is for the fish and how much quicker they get settled into the tank. I think he because there is not need for them to be chased around before being caught in the net.

What do others do?

Offline Helen

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Re: Introducing newly purchased fish to a tank
« Reply #1 on: January 28, 2018, 12:51:53 AM »
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What do you mean when you say you chase your fish with the net?

When I was acclimatising the fiveband barbs, I dropped my Seneye in the bag out of curiosity to what the ammonia did. I was surprised how little it went up over the hour or so that the fish were acclimatising (0.02ppm). So this time I worried less and didn't add the Seneye. I picked the corner of the tank where the plants reached the highest (vallis. Next to impossible to fix the bag at the middle back of the tank). I have been amazed how quickly the rainbows settled in. They've already coloured up enough for me to be able to tell the difference between the males and females (except for one that I'm not sure about!).

I know my lfs has pretty similar water to me too (because I tested the hardness of both when I added the barbs!)

And I've not fed the fish today. The existing inhabitants got frozen bloodworm yesterday because I didn't plan to feed them today. Because I'm still working out how much to feed the newbies, I compensate for overfeeding by not feeding every day. There's enough in the tank to keep them going (and the barbs are eating the algae if I don't give them anything else!)

Offline Matt

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Re: Introducing newly purchased fish to a tank
« Reply #2 on: January 28, 2018, 06:51:17 AM »
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All fishkeepers seem to add their fish in slightly different ways so I thought it would be interesting to see how we all did things.

Your doing it exactly how I used to and I think this is the most common way. It's reassuring that the ammonia didn't go up by much when you put your Seneye in the bag.

When i say chasing the fish, I'm referring to when I have the fish acclimated in the bag floating in the tank and I need to get them into the tank. To avoid putting any store water into my tank I put a net into the bag and 'fish' them out (pun alert!!). I imagine your doing the same? "Chasing" is probably not quite the right word...

I was talking to a store assistant the other day who was saying how he thought putting a nef into the bag was a bad idea for the stress levels of the fish.  Small space in bag, multiple fish that don't want to be separated, large scary net etc etc. He had caught too many fish than what id asked for and poured the whole lot back in the tank and started again rather than just catching one and putting it back - hence this conversation.

This is why I thought I'd do it the "pouring the temperature only acclimated fish out of the bag and into a net over a bucket" way, to see if the fish behaved any differently. Whilst I've only done it once (so no conclusions to be drawn yet!)  the fish did seem to be calmer in the net and seemed to start behaving normally in the tank sooner...

Are any others using this method or do you have your own schools (fish pun!) of thought on this?
 
   (I'll move this chat into another thread if it gets off topic too much @Helen)

Offline Helen

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Re: Introducing newly purchased fish to a tank
« Reply #3 on: January 28, 2018, 09:55:51 AM »
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Oh, ok. I just tip the store water into my tank! Yesterday I aclimatised the fish slowly by adding some of my water the bag, then tipped out the whole lot. I then got the same amount of water out again.

Offline Matt

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Re: Introducing newly purchased fish to a tank
« Reply #4 on: January 28, 2018, 11:00:26 AM »
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Ive always seen people comment that there's a risk when adding store water to your tank, that you bring a potential infection of some kind with it. That said... it has also just occured to me that stores often have highly medicated water , plus surely an infection is most likely to be carried on the fish itself... so maybe this isn't such a risk as people think??

Offline Sue

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Re: Introducing newly purchased fish to a tank
« Reply #5 on: January 28, 2018, 11:20:04 AM »
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It is commonly written that you shouldn't put shop water in your tank, though if you think about it, even if you net them out there will still be shop water coating the fish and net. Though I must admit that I can't bring myself to add a bag of shop water to my tank.

It's when you get fish by post that there is the real potential for there to be a lot of ammonia in the bag water. But the fish have not only been excreting ammonia, they have also been breathing out CO2. The CO2 will acidify the water so the ammonia will be in the non-toxic form. As soon as the bag is opened, CO2 starts to gas off, the pH rises and some ammonia converts to the more toxic form. For fish that have been in the bag for only the duration of the trip home from the shop, there should not be much ammonia in the water - or CO2.

A lot of experts now say that acclimatising fish by adding a bit of tank water to the bag every 15 mins for a couple of hours does nothing. It takes a couple of weeks for fish to acclimatise to new water so you may as well 'plop and drop', just leaving the bag floating long enough to equalise temperature. Since I discovered this, I no longer add tank water to the bag.

But I still net fish from the bag because I once had a fish jump out of the net onto the floor when I poured the water through a net into a bucket.

Offline Helen

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Re: Introducing newly purchased fish to a tank
« Reply #6 on: January 28, 2018, 12:06:47 PM »
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I've never been brave enough to buy fish through the post. Because I get all my fish from the same place, which is relatively near by, it's only a couple litres in 200l and I figure that the fish are the most likely carriers of problems, I just add the tank water.

Mr Helen and I were discussing the risks of adding new fish to the tank, yesterday. (I also don't use a quarantine tank!  :yikes:)

My philosophy is that by minimising stress to the fish, I'm giving them the best chance.

Interesting to hear what others think of my approach.

Offline Fishbeard

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Re: Introducing newly purchased fish to a tank
« Reply #7 on: January 28, 2018, 12:17:01 PM »
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I don't quarantine either - I have neither the tank nor the space, so I get them home, float the bag on the surface for about 15 minutes and then add tank water to the bag every 10-15 minutes for about an hour.

I then pour the bag into a shallow bucket with a net in place to capture the fish, which I then put in the tank. I'm not comfortable with putting shop water in the tank either.

Offline Littlefish

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Re: Introducing newly purchased fish to a tank
« Reply #8 on: January 28, 2018, 01:06:04 PM »
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I do quarantine fish, but then it is also common for me to purchase fish from several shops for the same tank, as I did for the river tank.
I do have space (well, not really, but also don't have anyone to tall me to take a quarantine tank off the dining table), and I have spare tanks.

Offline fcmf

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Re: Introducing newly purchased fish to a tank
« Reply #9 on: January 28, 2018, 03:44:07 PM »
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I do quarantine fish and wouldn't do so for less than a month; I used to do it for 2-3 weeks but then another member (Fiona, from recollection) ended up with a situation of "import whitespot" which only manifested itself several weeks down the line, so I made a mental note to ensure that any quarantine period would be for 4+ weeks. My rationale is quite simple and based on my life experience generally - if I didn't do it "by the book" and with 100% compliance, sure as anything, all would go completely awry (and then I'd be forever berating myself). However, most folk are generally more fortunate in that respect. 

I quarantined my snail for a week/fortnight (from recollection) and used to quarantine my plants for a few days but have stopped doing so.

Even with a QT, the situation can arise (as it did with me) when the QT has a new shoal of fish in it but some fish in the existing tank simultaneously require a hospital tank, so two spare tanks is probably required rather than just one.

Offline Sue

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Re: Introducing newly purchased fish to a tank
« Reply #10 on: January 28, 2018, 04:08:27 PM »
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It was me that had import spot, and very nasty it was too.

When I restocked after that I got virtually all the new fish from the same shop at the same time so there was no need to quarantine. I've only added since then - a couple more stiphodons from the same shop, a trio of honey gouramis from the same shop, and a replacement male honey gourami from Maidenhead Aquaticsbut took the risk for these fish and didn't quarantine them. The only real risk was the MA gourami as the others came from the same shop as the first batch.

Offline Helen

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Re: Introducing newly purchased fish to a tank
« Reply #11 on: January 28, 2018, 04:46:19 PM »
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Is it worth making the discussion on fish introductions a separate thread? That people do it differently and why, could be interesting for newbies.  ;)

Offline Sue

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Re: Introducing newly purchased fish to a tank
« Reply #12 on: January 28, 2018, 04:59:33 PM »
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@Helen, I have made the split but I seem to have lost the last post in the other thread  :o

Offline Matt

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Re: Introducing newly purchased fish to a tank
« Reply #13 on: January 28, 2018, 05:03:13 PM »
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I think we did it at the same time @Sue and the system got a bit confused... have i fixed it now?

Offline Sue

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Re: Introducing newly purchased fish to a tank
« Reply #14 on: January 28, 2018, 05:06:38 PM »
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I think it is now sorted. There appears to be just this one thread.

Maybe we should co-ordinate splits etc before doing them  ;D

Offline barneyadi

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Re: Introducing newly purchased fish to a tank
« Reply #15 on: January 28, 2018, 08:48:58 PM »
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Hi Sue

Can I just confirm you don't add water to the bag before adding fish to tank?

Offline Sue

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Re: Introducing newly purchased fish to a tank
« Reply #16 on: January 28, 2018, 09:50:17 PM »
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I used to add water to the bag, every 10 mins for an hour. But after reading about it taking at least 2 weeks for fish to acclimatise I haven't done that with the last few fish. I just leave the bag floating in the tank while i sort out the other shopping we've done, then net the fish out of the bag.

Offline Hampalong

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Re: Introducing newly purchased fish to a tank
« Reply #17 on: January 29, 2018, 02:01:53 AM »
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I don't usually quarantine. I trust myself to buy healthy fish, although if I buy unseen (i.e. mail order) I would have a tank available and decide when I saw them, just in case. If I don't see anything wrong with them I don't quarantine. I think putting them straight into their tank does them more good than going into a little tank for observation. This imo continues the stress and can lead to latent diseases appearing.
If a worry does appear I might run a course of Protozin, or if I suspect worms, Sterazin. I've used Waterlife all my life and I'm very comfortable treating the whole tank every time.

Acclimatising fish... well I've always tested pH and hardness, and the time taken to mix the waters adjusted accordingly. If they're very close the fish can go straight in, if they're far apart it will take a while. I know the average 3" goldfish produces 0.02ppm ammonia per day so I don't worry about ammonia with smaller fish.
If the fish are in a bucket I net them into the tank. If they're floating I turn the bag on its side and let them swim out. The bag usually gets emptied into the tank.
Nocturnal fish are always added with the lights out. Diurnal fish are always added with the lights on, or at least with enough light for them to see, and they stay on till they've settled somewhat.

If the fish is highly stressed in the bag, thrashing about or breathing too quickly, it'll go straight into the tank.


Offline Matt

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Re: Introducing newly purchased fish to a tank
« Reply #18 on: January 29, 2018, 07:05:14 AM »
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I know the average 3" goldfish produces 0.02ppm ammonia per day so I don't worry about ammonia with smaller fish.

That's really interesting, I had always thought 2 or 3ppm ammonia when cycling a tank seemed like a lot. That would be enough for 20 3" goldfish, so 150cm of fish... so presumably if you have a 60litre tank you would only need to do 1ppm?... or have i gone wrong somewhere with this?

I also don't turn off the lighting when adding fish like I know others do. I just keep the normal schedule going and maybe turn the lights down a bit for a couple of hours.  That said, I'm running a siesta period so they normally get added in the middle of that.

Offline Fishbeard

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Re: Introducing newly purchased fish to a tank
« Reply #19 on: January 29, 2018, 07:15:47 AM »
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I also don't turn off the lighting when adding fish like I know others do. I just keep the normal schedule going and maybe turn the lights down a bit for a couple of hours.  That said, I'm running a siesta period so they normally get added in the middle of that.

I don't have the tank lights on during the middle of the day either, so I've never needed to turn mine off to make new introductions before.

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