Author Topic: Treating Dropsy (Read 9854 times) 31 replies

uv · « **on:** February 06, 2019, 12:37:38 PM »

One of my guppy bloated and stayed on the substrate for a few days. It used to come for feeding but it did not turn up yesterday. I am searching for this missing one.

How to i treat that fish once found, probably it could be too late now.

What precautions should I take to save my other community fish in that tank. Please advise.

Matt · « **Reply #1 on:** February 06, 2019, 01:37:51 PM »

Was it a male or female?

Could be either needing to give birth (female) which would also explain why it's now hiding, or... could be constipation in which case feed cooked chopped peas with the shell removed (male).

uv · « **Reply #2 on:** February 06, 2019, 01:44:14 PM »

It is a male and bloated. I am trying to post a picture but the image is 4MB and the do not allow it.

Littlefish · « **Reply #3 on:** February 06, 2019, 02:13:19 PM »

You may need to re-size or crop the picture to be able to post it.

Do the fish scales look like a pine-cone? If not then the fish could be bloated/constipated. If the scales are sticking out like on a pine cone then this is more of a problem.

uv · « **Reply #4 on:** February 06, 2019, 03:25:08 PM »

I attached picture of my guppy.

fcmf · « **Reply #5 on:** February 06, 2019, 04:07:43 PM »

Yes, the way those scales are sticking up like a pinecone - particularly visible at the top between the head and the dorsal fin - does indeed suggest dropsy. Unfortunately, it's often difficult to cure once the condition reaches this stage. There are several possible causes for this e.g. bacterial, parasitic or viral infection.

It can be treated by isolating the fish in a separate tank/container and giving him an Epsom salt dip, with 1-3 teaspoons per 20 litres of water. Matt's suggestion of a chopped, cooked pea with the shell off can help in addition to this.

uv · « **Reply #6 on:** February 06, 2019, 04:50:25 PM »

Is the Epsom salt that we use for bath or is this any special for aquariums?

Also which antibacterial products good to cure?

Does this spread to other fish and of so what precautions could I take now?

Thank you

Littlefish · « **Reply #7 on:** February 06, 2019, 06:57:40 PM »

As far as I'm aware it is the same Epsom salts. I've not used that in my tanks, but I have used the Interpet Aqualibrium first aid salt additive.

Sue · « **Reply #8 on:** February 06, 2019, 07:12:14 PM »

The Epsom salts need to be plain, those for our baths often have perfume added. See if your local pharmacist has plain Epsom salts.

Epsom salt draws fluid from tissues. It is best used as a dip/bath. In a small tub, make up a solution at the rate of one 5ml spoonful per 3.75 litres of dechlorinated water at the same temperature as the tank. Place the fish in the tub for 30 minutes or until the fish becomes distressed whichever is sooner. Do this twice a day.

Aqualibrium seems to plain common salt, sodium chloride. As we know from ourselves, salt is a mid antiseptic (you can use salt water as an antiseptic mouthwash after having a tooth out). Epsom salts are magnesium sulphate. Common salt and Epsom salts do different things

The reason that is is not common for a fish to recover is that the infection, whichever 'bug' has caused it, causes kidney failure. It is this kidney failure that makes the fish swell out and the scales stick out. Kidney failure is virtually impossible to cure.
Antibacterials won't work if the underlying infection is caused by a virus or parasite. eSHa 2000 claims to cure dropsy, but most people find even this doesn't work as by the time we see symptoms it is too late. Try that if you wish, you may be one of the lucky ones.

uv · « **Reply #9 on:** February 06, 2019, 08:08:24 PM »

Thanks Sue, and others

This fish passed away yesterday. I had a good clean of my tank just now with 50% water change.

Can you please check if my other fish having the same problem?

Also, this epsom salt do the job? I got this from Asda. https://groceries.asda.com/product/bath-salts/westlab-pure-mineral-bathing-epsom-salt/910002000797

I am planning to add this directly to the tank. Is that advisable?

Thank you

Sue · « **Reply #10 on:** February 06, 2019, 08:29:31 PM »

I would not add epsom salts to the tank. Magnesium is one of the metals that make water hard so you'll be increasing the hardness of the tank water if you add it. It is not good for fish to alter the hardness of the tank water.

The other fish won't catch dropsy as it's not an infection, but they could catch the infection that lead to dropsy in the affected fish. The simplest way to keep the other fish healthy is a daily water change and substrate clean - deep clean gravel or hoover everything off sand.

The ASDA epsom salts look fine. It says "Pure, premium quality magnesium sulfate. 100% pure natural salts with nothing added" so there should be no perfume. You'll find it goes a long way at the dose needed for an epsom salt dip.

uv · « **Reply #11 on:** February 06, 2019, 08:46:46 PM »

Given that I no longer have this fish and not advisable to add Epsom salt to the tank directly, would it be safe to dip each fish for a bath or just the above one. The above one looks similar to how I saw my lost fish at an early stage.

Sue · « **Reply #12 on:** February 06, 2019, 08:55:33 PM »

I would try something like eSHa 2000 first - this can be added to the tank. Or Myxazin by Waterlife. Placing a fish in Epsom salts is stressful and it won't cure any type of infection, just draw fluid out of the body. You need to cure the underlying infection.

Can you tell me - do you have hard water or soft water? I do have a reason for asking.

uv · « **Reply #13 on:** February 06, 2019, 09:29:25 PM »

Quote from: Sue on February 06, 2019, 08:55:33 PM

I would try something like eSHa 2000 first - this can be added to the tank. Or Myxazin by Waterlife. Placing a fish in Epsom salts is stressful and it won't cure any type of infection, just draw fluid out of the body. You need to cure the underlying infection.

Can you tell me - do you have hard water or soft water? I do have a reason for asking.

That make sense. I have a very hard water.

Sue · « **Reply #14 on:** February 06, 2019, 09:33:30 PM »

Your hardness is fine. I just wanted to make sure your guppies weren't being affected by being in soft water - that would have made them more prone to disease.

uv · « **Reply #15 on:** February 07, 2019, 05:07:58 PM »

Out of curiosity, what ever happening to my fish now is a result of high nitrates?

Sue · « **Reply #16 on:** February 07, 2019, 05:23:27 PM »

How high is your nitrate?

It used to be thought that nitrate did not harm fish until it was well in the hundreds, but we now know that nitrate over 20 ppm shortens the life of fish. Since the UK (and most other countries) allow nitrate in tap water to be up to 50 ppm or thereabouts, some fishkeepers will have problems keeping their tank nitrate that low.

Can you test both your tap water and tank water for nitrate and tell us the results please.
If you use liquid reagent testers, one of the bottles will need shaking very well, then the test tube will need shaking. This shaking is an important part of the test but it is common for people to fail to do the shaking. Apologies if you already know this

uv · « **Reply #17 on:** February 07, 2019, 06:55:36 PM »

Tank nitrates are around 50 ppm and the tap nitrates 20-30 ppm.
I use test strips and I can read at 0, 10, 20, 50, 100 and 150 intervals.

I would like to opt out for liquid test but could not find a reasonable product that tests accurately between 20 to 80 ppm intervals.

Quote from: Sue on February 07, 2019, 05:23:27 PM

. Apologies if you already know this

I like being reminded, thank you.

Sue · « **Reply #18 on:** February 07, 2019, 07:39:48 PM »

So by water changes alone you can't get your tank nitrate below 20 to 30 ppm. But if you do large enough water changes (ie 50% per week) you should be able to keep your nitrate from going much higher than the tap water level. Live plants will also help especially floating ones (you may already have live plants!) Plants use ammonia as their preferred source of nitrogen and they take it up faster than the filter bacteria. They don't turn ammonia into nitrite and then on to nitrate like the bacteria do. If there are enough live plants, very little ammonia gets turned into nitrate.

There are also things which increase nitrate in the tank -
Too many fish (more fish make more ammonia which is turned into more nitrate)
Feeding the fish too much (uneaten food gets broken down to ammonia which is turned into nitrate)
Water changes not often enough (nitrate builds up higher if water changes are not frequent enough)
Water changes not big enough (not enough nitrate removed at each water change)
Filter not cleaned often enough (the brown goo is uneaten food, fish poo etc which is broken down to ammonia then on to nitrate)

Do any of these apply to your tank?

uv · « **Reply #19 on:** February 08, 2019, 08:43:24 AM »

Quote from: Sue on February 07, 2019, 07:39:48 PM

So by water changes alone you can't get your tank nitrate below 20 to 30 ppm. But if you do large enough water changes (ie 50% per week) you should be able to keep your nitrate from going much higher than the tap water level.

yes - I do 50% water change every week.

Quote from: Sue on February 07, 2019, 07:39:48 PM

Live plants will also help especially floating ones (you may already have live plants!) Plants use ammonia as their preferred source of nitrogen and they take it up faster than the filter bacteria. They don't turn ammonia into nitrite and then on to nitrate like the bacteria do. If there are enough live plants, very little ammonia gets turned into nitrate.

My floating plants are sucked up by the filter and when I have them maintenance became challenging. I do have Hygrophila 'Siamensis 53B' and Java Fern in the tank.

Quote from: Sue on February 07, 2019, 07:39:48 PM

There are also things which increase nitrate in the tank -
Too many fish (more fish make more ammonia which is turned into more nitrate)
Feeding the fish too much (uneaten food gets broken down to ammonia which is turned into nitrate)
Water changes not often enough (nitrate builds up higher if water changes are not frequent enough)
Water changes not big enough (not enough nitrate removed at each water change)
Filter not cleaned often enough (the brown goo is uneaten food, fish poo etc which is broken down to ammonia then on to nitrate)

I don't think I am over stocked. It's a 54l tank and I have 2 honey gouramies, 4 platies and 3 guppies. I don't see any left over flakes after the feed and I feed once a day (further to your advise on other thread). I do change water each week about 50%. I do see some brown goo (not much as I recently cleaned) but this may have came from the sucked up floating plants.

Recently, I found there is no place in the filter to grow beneficial bacteria and I record 0.25 ppm ammonia at every test. So, I added Matrix in the tank recently and within a couple of days ammonia dropped to zero and remain consistent, and the brown algae was all disappeared. When I did gravel vacuum I found lots of dust sucked up. Could this be a reason of infection?

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Treating Dropsy

Treating Dropsy

Author Topic: Treating Dropsy (Read 9854 times) 31 replies

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